Register    Login    Forum    FAQ

Board index » Blood Bowl » House Rules forum




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 118 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Narrow-Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 7:18 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 5109
Location: Copenhagen
Ever since I started playing 3rd edition Blood Bowl, I’ve wanted the different teams to be on more equal footing. If they were, more of the outlandish teams would get played, meaning more variety and fun for everyone in tournaments as well as leagues. Frankly, I find the 3 design tiers a nuisance in that regard – even more so because there is effectively a fourth tier – the powerteams.

With that in mind, I’ve set out to create simple yet efficient nerfs and buffs for just under half of the official teams – hoping to narrow the gap between the tiers. Note that it is not my ambition to make all teams completely equal, nor is it possible to make all teams equally strong against all types of opponents. Narrowing the gap significantly is the goal.

I’ve also added 3 homemade teams. Each was designed with a specific niche in mind, and each has been thoroughly playtested. I hope you’ll enjoy them as much as I have.

Enjoy :D
http://www.plasmoids.dk/1tier_BB.doc

_________________
Narrow Tier BB? http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/NTBB.htm
Or just visit http://www.plasmoids.dk instead


Last edited by plasmoid on Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:17 am 
Da Cynic
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 7457
Location: Nice Red Uniforms and Fanatical devotion to the Pope!
surely the Dwarf Linemen should be 10k cheaper

_________________
Image
Ikterus wrote:
But for the record, play Voyagers_UK if you have the chance. He's cursed! :P


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:38 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:42 pm
Posts: 2082
Location: York
AV8 flings and AV9 elves... :puke:

A team full of AV9, AG4 blodgers will be super tough to take down. AV8 elves usually end up being harder to kill than humans as it is.

_________________
My past and current modelling projects showcased on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:22 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 5109
Location: Copenhagen
I should probably say that I'm fairly indifferent to comments regarding the powerteams being nerfed too hard.
They needed a nerf.
And I'm sure they haven't dropped out of tier 1.

So - Voyagers_uk - dwarfs get a weaker skill at the same price, because that's a nerf.
Weaker skill at a discount is hardly a nerf. It's pretty much same-same.

I'm much more interested to hear whether the tier 3 teams have been buffed enough? I'd want them to land in absolute bottom of tier 1.

Cheers
Martin

_________________
Narrow Tier BB? http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/NTBB.htm
Or just visit http://www.plasmoids.dk instead


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:24 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 5109
Location: Copenhagen
Hi Spubbbba,
Having played the AV9 elves for a 50 game season I'm confident to say that you underestimate what low speed does to a team that doesn't stand and fight very well.

As for the AV8 halflings: They are very well padded :D
With ST2 and stunty, they still go squish fairly often.

Cheers
Martin

_________________
Narrow Tier BB? http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/NTBB.htm
Or just visit http://www.plasmoids.dk instead


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:10 pm 
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:01 pm
Posts: 177
Location: Finland
I can not judge the effect, but found a small typo.

Ogre team got the same discount as the Human team on ogres, but it is not listed with the other changes on page 1.

Those changes should knock of 100 points of extra TV on a developed Ogre team. That coupled with MA6 snotlings should have some effect at least.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:46 pm 
Da Cynic
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 7457
Location: Nice Red Uniforms and Fanatical devotion to the Pope!
plasmoid wrote:
I should probably say that I'm fairly indifferent to comments regarding the powerteams being nerfed too hard.
They needed a nerf.
And I'm sure they haven't dropped out of tier 1.

So - Voyagers_uk - dwarfs get a weaker skill at the same price, because that's a nerf.
Weaker skill at a discount is hardly a nerf. It's pretty much same-same.

I'm much more interested to hear whether the tier 3 teams have been buffed enough? I'd want them to land in absolute bottom of tier 1.

Cheers
Martin


You're sure? How? What empirical data do you have.... [prepare to throw plasmoid under the bus] You remember how you liked Gold edition? Can your suppositions be trusted?[Plasmoid thrown under bus]

Dwarf linemen without block and but Wrestle and still MA 4 is a huge nerf, not a small one.

And as for saying you're indifferent to comments regarding powerteams. Why nerf them at all then or why show them as nerfed? People will comment, that is a fact. People are indifferent to multiple polls, at least at first...

I am not sure where you are coming from anymore after that comment

_________________
Image
Ikterus wrote:
But for the record, play Voyagers_UK if you have the chance. He's cursed! :P


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:54 pm 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 6:58 pm
Posts: 2737
Location: Watching the great unclean armpits of a Beast Of Nurgle
Goblins don't need 3 trolls, I'm not sure this is even a buff since having an extra really stupid player may do more harm to them than it does them good. Rostered bribes would be more effective.

_________________
Image

Nuffle Sucks!


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:51 pm 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 5109
Location: Copenhagen
Dear Grim Ironjaw :wink:
You're miffed that I'd nerf the dwarf team? Looking for a buff instead? :D

Quote:
And as for saying you're indifferent to comments regarding powerteams. Why nerf them at all then or why show them as nerfed?

Huh?
I'd nerf them because they're needlessly good - and it would be good for the game to rein them in.
And I'm fairly indifferent to the gnashing of teeth or pulling of beards, because I for every coach loving the überteams and wanting to preserve their power, I think there are more who think they're over the top.
Coincidentally, I haven't seen Jordell in here defending the poor dwarfs 8)
But I wonder if infamous wood elf coach Borin will swing by to tell me that wood elfs are almost unplayable :lol:

Quote:
You're sure? How? What empirical data do you have....

You sort of sound like you have empirical data backing up your claim that wrestle will ruin the team. I wonder if it would really push them out of tier 1.

Well, I have the LRB6 stats showing that dwarfs are overperforming.
Wrestle is worse for dwarf linemen, sure, but it adds versatility to the team. In some situations it is better - and with 4 players that keep block, the dwarf team have lots of advantages left.

Quote:
You remember how you liked Gold edition? Can your suppositions be trusted?

Geee mister Grim, getting a bit emotional? :P
For the record, I did not like gold.
I did exactly what I did when I didn't like vault 1.0
I tried to pull things in the right direction, by making suggestions to improve on what crap had been handed down.
In gold it got me ridiculed.
In vault one, it was the other camp, those trying to derail the process at all cost, that ended up with egg on their faces.
Such is life.

I hope that clears up my position - no offense intended :)
Martin

_________________
Narrow Tier BB? http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/NTBB.htm
Or just visit http://www.plasmoids.dk instead


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:04 pm 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 5109
Location: Copenhagen
Hi Duke Jan,
Quote:
Goblins don't need 3 trolls

Based on the LRB6 stats, and my ambition to put them in bottom tier1, they do.

Quote:
I'm not sure this is even a buff since having an extra really stupid player may do more harm to them than it does them good.

OK, thanks.
I'd be happy to hear what others think. Especially gobbo coaches. ?!?
In my experience, player loss is brutal for gobbo teams, and 3 big AV9 regen players for the LOS can help with that. I've also played gobbos with a troll KO'd, and a spare would have been nice there too.

Quote:
Rostered bribes would be more effective.

It would certainly have beeen a nice buff. I like it.
I decided to not go with someone like that, because it would have been a completely unprecedented and unique rule that would have required changes to the rulebook and not just the roster.
But it's a neat suggestion :D

Cheers
Martin :D

_________________
Narrow Tier BB? http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/NTBB.htm
Or just visit http://www.plasmoids.dk instead


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:03 pm 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:42 pm
Posts: 2082
Location: York
plasmoid wrote:
Hi Spubbbba,
Having played the AV9 elves for a 50 game season I'm confident to say that you underestimate what low speed does to a team that doesn't stand and fight very well.


50 games isn't a lot, come back with over 1000 games against all 24 teams with varying coach ability and at different TV's and then they'll have some merit.

With AG4 and easy access to dodge then you don't need to stand and fight when facing a bashier opponent, you can easily run away and pick your fights, heck I can do that with the 4 existing elf teams now.

plasmoid wrote:
As for the AV8 halflings: They are very well padded :D
With ST2 and stunty, they still go squish fairly often.

Cheers
Martin


Being fat doesn't make them any tougher and at 40K they seem to be very cheap.

The fluff just doesn't support either of those changes, flings are supposed to go squish and AV9 should be reserved for the players that are either super tough like big guys or tough and well armoured like dwarfs and orcs.

_________________
My past and current modelling projects showcased on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:06 pm 
King of Comedy
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 6:18 pm
Posts: 7716
Location: Far to the west, across the great desert, in the fabled Land of Comedy
That's some radical stuff.

I like some of the changes, and not others, like I think most coaches will. I suspect that you'd find if you asked around the buffs were probably more popular than the nerfs.

_________________
What is Nuffle's view? Through a window, two-by-three. He peers through snake eyes.
What is Nuffle's lawn? Inches, squares, and tackle zones: Reddened blades of grass.
What is Nuffle's tree? Risk its trunk, space the branches. Touchdowns are its fruit.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:54 pm 
Experienced
Experienced

Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 10:53 am
Posts: 120
Radical but sensible stuff if you want my opinion, probably a bit too early though since the power rankings for LRB6 have not stabilized yet. For instance, when I look at the statistics on your website (Excellent resource btw!), I wonder about the high rankings of the Necro and Elf...

There is a team I am surprised you did not address, the Amazons. I think this is the roster with the worst design in the game, bar none. All players are 6337 Dodge clones, with access to four Blodge players. This is clearly an overpowered team at low TV, but there are two huge caveats: The Dwarfs and their AV7 that catches up with them at high TV when Tackle and killer skills becomes more prevalent. I think such an imbalance between Tournament and League play is quite unhealthy.

The proposal by DoubleSkull to make the Amazon the AG3 passing team was a step in the right direction, as well as the one making the (Imperial) Humans a bit more bashy with a passing option in order to keep them in the middle. Because of power creep, they have been pushed in the uncomfortable position of having both weak passing (by design) and bashing (by comparison) games.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:58 pm 
Da Spammer
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2002 10:04 pm
Posts: 23430
Location: Fundamentaling for the BB Illuminati
[Mod Hat on(before/just in case anything kicks off)]
Thankfully, those in power of the rules wannted, and got, various tiers in Blood Bowl.

This is in House Rules, and there it will remain, so if you don't agree with Plasmoids' premise, don't post.

[Mod hat off]

_________________
"I survived the 525!"
ARBBL 2017 Stunty Cup winner - even if I didn't get a chuffin' trophy!
SAWBBowl I Runner Up - with Vamps!
Block of Holding Runner Up *shakes fist at 20phoenix*


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 1 Tier Blood Bowl
 Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:27 pm 
Da Cynic
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 7457
Location: Nice Red Uniforms and Fanatical devotion to the Pope!
noted, simply I do not agree with some of what was started here...

No offense taken Martin. We're good!

_________________
Image
Ikterus wrote:
But for the record, play Voyagers_UK if you have the chance. He's cursed! :P


Top 
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 118 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next

Board index » Blood Bowl » House Rules forum


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to: