Changed Pro Elves roster

[dodolulu]

hello,

in the league im playing there are just a few pro elves coaches. in general they seem to be not that popular.
when i think about them, i think they are too similar to high elves but more squishy and rely more on their blitzers and catchers.
while high elve catchers are junior wardancers with a "wasted" bonus skill, pro elve catchers have two of these skills, so even more overhead.

what about shifting them a little bit more in the dark elf direction while not taking away the pass option?
i think of a rugby style gameplay mixed with passing play.

4 blitzers that lose ss but gain dump off and only 2 catchers. since dump off isnt as good as ss, especially without easy nos-access and their linemen are already a little bit overpriced, id give their linemen wrestle or maybe fend (as they are already pro linemen) for no price increase.

0-16 lineman 6 3 4 7 wrestle GA 60k
0-2 thrower 6 3 4 7 pass GAP 70k
0-2 catcher 8 3 4 7 catch, nos GA 100k
0-4 blitzers 7 3 4 8 block, dumpoff GA 110k

what do you think about that?

[garion]

Far far too good.

Pro elves are a top tier team already, that would make them the best team in the game.

If you want to give them a small buff just get rid of the thrower and give the catchers P access, that would also make them a little different to High Elves as they woudlnt start witha natural thrower but a catcher would function as one (chane name to runner) But I really don't think they need any change or improvement, they are the most cost effective elves in the game and can pretty much score at will.

[dodolulu]

what exactly is far far too good?

is it the exchange of 2 good players with 2 other good players that got rid of side step?
or is it the addition of wrestle on their linemen? after all they are we-linemen without ma7 or de/he-linemen without av8.
normally you pay 20k for av7->av8 or ma6->ma7.

i dont want to buff them, i would like to shift their playstyle from 95% high elves to somehting more even between he and de. but by increasing their running game and decreasing their passing game i think you should make them (their linemen) at least a little bit tougher.

[garion]

I do understand where you are coming from in respet to them being too similar to high elves mind.

One of the reasons Pro elves are so good already is how cheap they are and their Catchers are the best in the game.

What makes your roster so good is all their linemen start with wrestle and 4 blitzers start with block. This means you could have an 11 man roster that is better at blocking than dwarves because they have anti bash/slow team skills(wrestle) and they are faster and more agile than most teams. It also means you would start off with a perfect ball sacking skill.
to give all your linemen wrestle you would need to give them +20k or at the least +10k price increase. 4 players with av8, ag4 and dump off would be helish to play against as well.

I'm not sure how you could change pro elves really I think they are a very well structured teams. Personally I would be more inclined to change high elves if either of them.

Plasmoid has created an interesting roster for a new elf team and you could change high elves or pro elves too it, it has also been play tested and is quite different, so it might be worth a shot.

This is the team, just change the name to either pro or high elf depending on which you would like to change. Personally I think it would fit high elves more because of the high Av.
I would also consider dropping the runners Av to 7 or dropping Jump Up if they proove too good. It is hard to say if they are too good or not at the moment in the test league because the coach playing with them is one of the top coaches about so he will win most games with most races tbh.

ITHILMAR ELF TEAMS
The Ithilmar elves see Blood Bowl as religion rather than sports. The cult was founded by the original High Elf contingent who discovered the first temple of Nuffle and studied the rules alongside Roze-El. Their faith is for the pure-blooded determined elven elite, their gear ithilmar heirlooms.
Qty Title Cost MA ST AG AV Skills Talent
0-16 Linemen 70,000 5 3 4 9 None GA
0-2 Throwers 90,000 5 3 4 9 Pass, Kick-Off Return GAP
0-4 Blitzers 100,000 6 3 4 9 Block GA
0-2 Runner 100,000 7 3 4 8 Jump Up GA

anyway, I hope you give this a whirl and Plasmoid will be very interested to see how they perform, as you can see they are the highest armoured elves and the slowest so they require a different approach than high or pro elf teams.

[the.tok]

AG4 AV9 seems like a killer combo to me. even with below average MA.
The thing is their TV will rise sharply and reach summit, because everyone will skill up easily and they won't die that much, the team will quickly be blodge on everyone

Playtest will tell, but I see a top tier team here though I could be totally wrong

And...
OMG I want those 4 blitzers

[garion]

yeah abosolutely, they are definately a top tier team, though should develop a little slower than any of the other elves because of their inability to win big.

But anyway, which of the elves are not a top tier team? all of them are really so these would not be alone in that respect. I just fear they might join Wood Elves in the Eeite tier (tier 0), but I guess only time will tell and in this world of cpomb craziness Av isn't what it once was.

[the.tok]

Sure, but AV9 + blodge + sidestep/fend will be another story...
They'll be much harder to catch than, say, longbeards

[garion]

Fend pfft.

Yeah, as I said they seem great to me, but its not my roster anyway, and at least it has had some testing, so if the Op wants to change one of the rosters I would give this a whirl over anything else really and its certainly no where near as strong at the OPs suggestion.

[the.tok]

its certainly no where near as strong at the OPs suggestion.

For sure but...

Less broken, I would say

[plasmoid]

Hi all
Garion - thanks for bringing these guys up. I know we don't agree on everything, so I'm glad to see that you kind of like the Ithilmar Elfs. Coincidentally, I came up with the original version of this team back around LRB3 or so, when Darkies and High Elfs were still vastly similar, and Pro Elfs were then added on top of that. The 3 teams just felt so redundant that we replaced the High Elfs with the AV9 elfs.

Back then, I played them in a 50 game season.
I'm a pretty good coach (or I was), and I did decently with them - but it certainly wasn't one of my best seasons.
Back then ofcourse, Fouling was harsher and PiOn was a big modifier to the armor roll, so they were more vulnerable. On the other hand, you could grow (any) team to TV300+ with no real consequences.

The team has been discussed on here before, and as house rule teams go, they've been recieved pretty well.

Durable elfs look awesome on paper. And trey're certainly a tier 1 team. I doubt they're above that, but admittedly CRP is different than LRB3. Not getting hurt very often is sweet - (though against claw teams, they're in trouble) - that being said, being that slow really hampers the elven playing style. You don't outmaneuver anyone, you have to cut a lot of corners, do a lot of GFIs, no cool vertical shifts, and very importantly: In a 2-1 grind you don't really have the option to respond with an OTS. Heck, 2 turn scores can be tricky.

They get compared to dwarfs and orcs a lot. Just with 'broken' or 'awesome' attached to that. But they aren't super-orcs or power-dwarfs. Both teams are pretty good at getting numerical supiriority - which you kind of need when you're slow. Ithilmar Elfs aren't good at that. And lack of any access to guard can also be rough when you get bogged down.

As Garion said, Peter, who is currently playing them is an excellent coach. And he is doing well. I think I'll probably cut kick-off return off the Throwers, just to make that low MA sting a little more. But so far I'm not convinced that they're super awesome.

Cheers
Martin