New winnings table

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 6:28 pm

GalakStarscraper wrote:The TR limits are there because I've seen TR 500 teams in 3rd edition ... and no matter how you look at it that's just plain wrong.
Galak

Why specifically? Incidentally I've seen teams over 600.

Personally I agree with you somewhat. I think 500 is a little much. But I don't have a problem with 400 or so. I'm just trying to get you to clarify your position. Why do you dislike big teams?

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 7:35 pm

Because my tabletop leagues are normally small. I and my fellow players enjoy playing the same team for a long period. A team allowed to grow unchecked will squash a rookie like a bug.

So you have a problem ... don't allow new members or force retirement of teams after say 2 league seasons. I hate both of these options and the league isn't big enough to have seperate divisions or to really protect the rookie from playing the monster.

The new rules allow veteran members to play the same team forever ... retiring the team only when they feel like it. Within one league season, any rookie will quickly be up to their level and while the first several games will not be easy ... the team playing them will not be some monster that will destroy them automatically.

Galak

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 7:50 pm

I've never really had a problem with any of these things occuring. There are people here who only play blood bowl once in a while, and there are people who play the maximum 2 games per week (per team). So a new coach would just NOT PLAY the big teams for a while. All they'd have to do is find opponents their approximate size. There are always some.

The other thing we do that helps keep a wide range of team sizes is this. Every coach has one team in the "premier" league. Then they can have any number of other teams in the "minor" league (not more than one of each race though). So if your team is too big for the rookie who wants a game, you make a new minor league team of a different race and play them.

I don't see why all the teams have to be smaller...

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 11:47 pm

My other comment to that which I know I'll have folks disagree with ...

I don't enjoy playing Blood Bowl with teams over 250ish TR. I LOVE the uncertainity that lower end teams bring to the game. You have SOME skills but not loads so you have to make due with what you have. Not every lineman has Block, not every thrower Accurate.

When the skills start stacking up it can become just very difficult to enjoy the game to me. Last big match I played was TR 298 vs TR 313 ... my opponent and I took turn scoring every 2 turns the entire match and it was about the most boring game I've played in my entire life.

I'm a diehard fan of the entire LRB/BB2k1 package in terms of what its done to create a pseudo ceiling on TR as its creates the type of BB that I enjoy.

Galak

Pink Horror · Post by **Pink Horror** » Thu Jul 25, 2002 12:58 am

I think some smart roster management and a little luck could allow you to eventually break the 300 TR ceiling. If your SPPs outpace your deaths its only a matter of time.

The new table is fine. It allows you to be more like an NFL team. The TR is like a flexible salary cap. You'll have some good seasons in which you abuse it add get ahead, but I bet that comes back to bite you later and you have to shed talent to reorganize. I have a master plan for this whole thing that I'd love to try out.

The current system rewards you if you can squeeze a competitive team into 160 - 180 TR. I bet if you hold back in your early games you can build a better team for the long run (which is partly why I prefer low FF). Fire players constantly, hire freebooters and wizards, and let the handicap table give you a helping hand. When the time is right, hold onto your team, shoot for TR 260 or so, and dominate your league.

Pink Horror

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Thu Jul 25, 2002 2:25 am

GalakStarscraper wrote:Last big match I played was TR 298 vs TR 313 ... my opponent and I took turn scoring every 2 turns the entire match and it was about the most boring game I've played in my entire life.

That's odd...more often than not you'll find that team defense improves along with team offense. In fact I had an orc team in the online leagues around TR 350 or so that it was nearly impossible to score against. We had a lot of 1-0 games.

Since it was an online league, I even have the roster up for you to look at if you're interested.
http://mama.indstate.edu/users/python/b ... lorcs.html

Had a ton of fun with that team. Best orc team I've ever had, although they could have had much better dice.

My wood and dark elves get very good at defense as well.

GalakStarscraper wrote: I'm a diehard fan of the entire LRB/BB2k1 package in terms of what its done to create a pseudo ceiling on TR as its creates the type of BB that I enjoy.

Galak

Well as I've said numerous times I like the concept but think it's been taken too far.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Thu Jul 25, 2002 2:55 am

This post is meant in all seriousness not flippant at all.

Wes ... if you think its gone too far ... house rule it back down which I've believe you've suggested is your intention.

There are very few vanilla leagues out there and its one of the beauties of the game is the fact that its a game where most folks EXPECT each league to have house rules. Every time I've sat down with a group the first question I always ask is "What are the house rules?" and I don't argue them one bit and sit down to throw dice.

So far the new winnings table has a lot of support. I understand that you think it went too far and heck Chet even conceeded that maybe TR 100 should get an extra +1 to the dice, but I doubt you'll see the shift that you've proposed before in the thread.

I fully understand that you like the LRB rules in concept and on that we agree. If you think that higher TR cap is better for your league's flavor then I would sincerely encourage you to loosen the table. For my taste and my leagues, the table works great. Just a matter of how much spice you add to your food.

Galak

sean newboy · Post by **sean newboy** » Thu Jul 25, 2002 3:18 pm

I'll just say that i did like the +10k for winning added on at the end, i really dont think a winning team should ever walk away with no money.

Acerak · Post by **Acerak** » Thu Jul 25, 2002 8:37 pm

So humor me for a minute. Everyone on here has been talking kinda like it's a given about why it's good to cap a team at a given level. Why it that the case?

The game wasn't built to handle these teams. The ever-upward spiral of 3E proved that. Jervis wanted the BBRC to create rules that allowed for "perpetual Blood Bowl." I think the longevity of a team - and thus, of a league - is now at its peak. You could keep teams (and leagues) going now without ever retiring them because they had become "too powerful." And I think that's a good thing.

Cheers!

-Chet