GW annual shareholder meeting - 2015 - future of Blood Bowl

[GalakStarscraper]

I would happily license the old ranges of Blood Bowl for example.

The problem is that GW does everything big or nothing.

I have licensing contracts from over 20 real companies in my time running Impact!

I've approached GW several times to try to license something and my last effort I got a phone call instead of an email.

"Tom we appreciate you wanting to work with us but unless you can promise us 500k GBP in licensing revenue PER a product licensed per a year, GW just does not feel it is worth the time to license out that product."

And thus many items that could add up to real revenue stream never do for them.

[Wulfyn]

Wulfryn... you've taken a bit of a joke, wound it up into a straw man, and are now laying into the NAF for what we've said only in your imagination.

I've not laid into the NAF at all - I'm a big fan of the NAF. I think they do a great job. My argument was about using them as an authority to persuade Cyanide. You saying that I am laying into the NAF is the only strawman here.

Also from 1st hand knowledge ... I'm pretty sure

Do you realise that this is a contradiction? You're saying that you have absolute knowledge that you don't know. Your entire post is based on assumptions and guesses, and at one point you even admit you can't know because people have been told not to talk about it. Your post is an appeal, and is logically invalid. Someone that had been trained at persuasion would spot that.

You are taking a series of speculations and trying to treat them as fact. It's no wonder Darkson +1'd your post!

Here's an example:

So given that I'm 99% sure that Wulfryn is incorrect with his belief that the community did not get involved.

I never said the community did not get involved. I gave a specific example (plasmoid) of a community member that did get involved. What I am saying is that they did a really bad job with persuading Cyanide with regard to influencing what they have done. I think the evidence for that is clear, and the replies that it was an impossible task are excuses for poor performance from people who don't really understand what persuasion is.

Here's another example:

Finally ... all of my experience with Cyanide is that it is THEY who invite you to help

This is not really persuasion. If someone comes to you asking for advice, you give it, and they follow it, then you have not persuaded anyone of anything. Persuasion is about taking someone's firmly held belief and changing their mind. Simply stating your case and then complaining when people don't follow what you want shows an inability to persuade others.

Here's another example:

Twice I've seen things go wrong because Cyanide would not listen to repeated messages about the problems they had in the software or the design concept.

Repeated messages? That's a telling phrase. People never listen to repeated messages they don't like. Repeating an unwanted message lessens your ability to persuade them rather than increasing it. People become further entrenched in their position. Repeating a message that is not being heeded is one of the simplest mistakes that people who have not been trained to persuade others make. Repetition furthers the direction; a positively received message becomes more positive and a negatively received message becomes more negative. It even influences their opinion of you for future unrelated messages. 'Oh that's just Darkson banging on the same drum' type responses.

My point is that the failure of people to persuade Cyanide can be taken in one of two ways. Either you can take sann' approach of saying that it is their fault for not listening, that they are heading for an icebeerg, that they are making mistakes, and if only they would listen to us then all would be right, but if they are not going to listen then there is nothing I can do about it. Or you can stop making excuses, realise thet you could have done a better job, and push yourself to get the training and skillset so that when confronted with future opportunities you will succeed. You will make a difference. You will change things for the better. You will not blame others and make excuses, but understand that you have the potential to succeed if only you were to accept that you can be better.

Or you can just take the easy road and blame Cyanide.

[sann0638]

Sheesh, the iceberg thing was a joke. Yes, it would obviously be nice to find someone who had the "skillset" to persuade Cyanide to create the game with the options that a large number of players want. Know anyone?

[Loki]

Wulfyn,

you have obviously taken the time to write a number of posts, in a number of which you have said...

That's my point

but as far as I can see most of your rhetoric is argumentative and pedantic. In a few lines can you say what your point is?

I'm sorry if English is not your first language or you have failed to make your feelings clear but your tone comes across as condescending and snide, what makes you think anyone reading this would want to take your advice?

If we work together, we can make a difference.

[GalakStarscraper]

Or you can stop making excuses, realise thet you could have done a better job, and push yourself to get the training and skillset so that when confronted with future opportunities you will succeed.

Easy to state the text you typed when you have no first hand knowledge at all so you speak pie in the sky theory (which is what you basically stated my text was). Your speech sounds just like when Tom Cruise said that postpartum depression was something that could be fixed just by thinking happy thoughts. Saying that someone's first hand knowledge has no relevance (in court cases character witness testimony and prior behavior is actually surprisingly considered valuable) and trying to say the community failed if Cyanide did not listen is really not connected to reality.

I'm not trying to overly bash you Wulfyn ... but effectively you've suggested that in my life if a relationship fails I should always consider it my fault. I work with depression issues in kids. We NEVER teach that message so reading it in your post really struck me on a nerve. Yeah some failure is on a person ... but some failure is going to happen because the other party is clueless, arrogant or both and there was nothing that could be done to make it work. Your suggestion is that the assumption is that Cyanide is perfect so it must be the community's fault which really is just not based in the reality of those that have dealt with them.

[Itchen Masack]

Itchen Masack ... honestly guys you know not of what you speak.

Well for fear of distracting the eyes away from Wulfyn, I'd rather not let this go without at least a comment from myself. Being dismissed in such a manner is sometimes unpleasant.

I'm sure people have approached Cyanide, and as you say Cyanide have approached some people, the 'Names' that they know surrounding BB. But these are individuals. My regret on the matter is that the NAF (to my knowledge, maybe they did without telling) who represent x-thousand blood bowl players, didn't approach Cyanide in the early stages of BB2. Cyanide would be fools to ignore such a large number of potential customers surely?

The only action I saw was the petition against ageing, and this came too late as a first involvement, and that is the shame for which I spoke. To a casual observer as myself, it just seemed that everyone was hoping Cyanide would just re-make BB again, prettier, but without the bugs (or quite possibly didn't care about Cyanide at all). Turns out Cyanide haven't done that

[dode74]

My regret on the matter is that the NAF (to my knowledge, maybe they did without telling) who represent x-thousand blood bowl players, didn't approach Cyanide in the early stages of BB2. Cyanide would be fools to ignore such a large number of potential customers surely?

Surely not...

[Darkson]

I know Lycos was talking to Cyanide soon after Cyanide announced BB2 (he mentioned it here) and I guess he's have his NAF hat on.

[dode74]

I know for a fact that NAF tried to talk to BB, that a number of us testers tried to get Cyanide to talk to NAF, and that Cyanide ARE foolish enough to ignore them.

[Shteve0]

Quite where anyone would get the idea that we wouldn't have, and wouldn't continue to, explore every possible angle on this front is beyond me. As is the assumption we wouldn't understand basic stakeholder engagement and relationship management principles. Just bizarre.

[odinsgrandson]

As for buying the BB IP. The last time I asked I was told that 1M GBP was the price. That was about 8 years ago though.

Is there any possibility we could kickstart that?

[Darkson]

Problem is (ignoring all the legal stuff like if we did who would own it) you'd get a figure of GW, then they'd see the money raised and double the asking price.

[Shteve0]

OG - I doubt it. That number was pre-Cyanide - if they want £500k gbp every year in licensing straight off the bat these days then there's little chance of them selling it at all.

More to the point, I suspect we'd need to make a pretty exceptional case for why we'd need or want to buy it - even if every member of the NAF ever threw in £150 each we'd only just hit £1m.

[Itchen Masack]

Guess it's kinda like a Christian leader telling me there is a God watching over everything. I'd like to believe in God, but there seems to be so very little actual visible evidence, which must be where Faith comes in. Or rather, until just now, it was like the Christian leader hadnt even told me there was a God, and couldnt believe that I didnt know he existed.

So that's why I can think every avenue wasnt explored. I saw very little actual evidence with mine own eyes. But maybe that's just the nature of such things so there's no reason for me to think anything at all.

I suspect my daughter washes her hands everytime she goes into the toilet, but I dont know, and I also think she'd be offended if I asked her. So I'll just butt out now as everything seems to be under control

[Shteve0]

I think it's probably more akin to assuming the local farmer, intending to breed cattle, doesn't know better than to fornicate with his cow rather than get a bull do it.