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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 7:29 pm 
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[first time poster, hello everyone]

Not a rule change, but it seems to fit here: On their last Q&A stream GW said that big guys (at least the orge) will use the same 32mm bases as regular players. No words on when or how they are supposed to be released, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 7:57 pm 
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Deathrain wrote:
[first time poster, hello everyone]

Not a rule change, but it seems to fit here: On their last Q&A stream GW said that big guys (at least the orge) will use the same 32mm bases as regular players. No words on when or how they are supposed to be released, though.


Thanks for that. That was to be expected as the previous big guys fit easily on 30mm bases. So there was no expectation of scale creep to have them on bases that didn't fit in the squares.

Old and new players should be able to use the 30mm bases that are available easily from US and UK sites instead of the GW 32mm ones to base all the new figures (Big Guy or not) to work with old or new boards.

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 9:04 pm 
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GalakStarscraper wrote:
birdman37 wrote:
Absolute comedy gold. That kind of story isn't going to happen with the new rules.
+1


We've used the d3 system as a house rule for close to a decade and vastly prefer it. Blood Bowl takes two hours (at least) of your time and if, at the end of a savage beating, your only SPPs (the MVP) go to a dead guy or a star, the negative play experience is palpable.

That said, plenty of local coaches still nominate players for fluff reasons ("That lineman got KOed and never came back but he protected the ballcarrier with his broken face so he gets nominated!") instead of just min/maxing it all the time.

So the super-Lineman story is still absolutely part of Blood Bowl. The d3 system just removes a potential negative experience so bad I've seen it drive players from the game.

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 9:59 pm 
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SunDevil wrote:

We've used the d3 system as a house rule for close to a decade and vastly prefer it. Blood Bowl takes two hours (at least) of your time and if, at the end of a savage beating, your only SPPs (the MVP) go to a dead guy or a star, the negative play experience is palpable.

That said, plenty of local coaches still nominate players for fluff reasons ("That lineman got KOed and never came back but he protected the ballcarrier with his broken face so he gets nominated!") instead of just min/maxing it all the time.

So the super-Lineman story is still absolutely part of Blood Bowl. The d3 system just removes a potential negative experience so bad I've seen it drive players from the game.



+1 heavily agree

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:03 am 
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SunDevil wrote:
We've used the d3 system as a house rule for close to a decade and vastly prefer it. Blood Bowl takes two hours (at least) of your time and if, at the end of a savage beating, your only SPPs (the MVP) go to a dead guy or a star, the negative play experience is palpable.

That said, plenty of local coaches still nominate players for fluff reasons ("That lineman got KOed and never came back but he protected the ballcarrier with his broken face so he gets nominated!") instead of just min/maxing it all the time.

So the super-Lineman story is still absolutely part of Blood Bowl. The d3 system just removes a potential negative experience so bad I've seen it drive players from the game.

There is a middle path that also removes the negative: random among your own players that are still alive.


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:34 am 
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Steam Ball wrote:
There is a middle path that also removes the negative: random among your own players that are still alive.

That would be one of the optional rules in CRP iirc...


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 1:57 am 
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dode74 wrote:
Steam Ball wrote:
There is a middle path that also removes the negative: random among your own players that are still alive.

That would be one of the optional rules in CRP iirc...

Yes. BB2016 went beyond removing the negative, just small randomness away from "pick one", the other option given as suggestion in CRP.


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 6:05 am 
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I like all the choices you get to make as manager/team owner now.

You now decide who gets MVPs (out of 3)
You decide what/if to spend money on inducements.
You decide who stays on the roster
You decide whether or not it's worth paying a 20K premium for a vet.
You decide how much cash to risk leaving in your bank.
You can try to play more aggressive to generate cash.

In CRP you pretty much only decided how many rerolls you wanted and whether or not to fire that niggle/stat decrease. I just think this is better.


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 1:33 pm 
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You don't have to take all or none. I hate the new MVP rule, and it seems to work against the other new stuff. Much easier to stay under budget if your Dirty Player has absolutely no chance of ever leveling up by accident (unless a bunch of people double skull on him and injure themselves).

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:46 am 
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Gaixo wrote:
You don't have to take all or none. I hate the new MVP rule, and it seems to work against the other new stuff. Much easier to stay under budget if your Dirty Player has absolutely no chance of ever leveling up by accident (unless a bunch of people double skull on him and injure themselves).
I'm a fan of all or none when it comes to the new rules. What you call "work against" I call "balance." To me, many of the new rules, by themselves, would imbalance things. When taken all together I feel they work best.

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:39 pm 
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Throughly despise the expensive mistakes rule after my halfling treasury went from 310k to just 40k :pissed: also, losing 30k from 100k on my vamp team has halted their progress.

Combine this garbage with a re-drafting system that suits longer seasons and teams better at low TV, I foresee a lot disgruntled coaches.

Seriously, redrafting would be ok with a tighter spiraling expenses system and no expensive mistakes as it would do a fairer job of leveling the playing field at the start of each season.

I'm not a power gamer (as evidenced by the 2 teams above), but it's making it less appealing to use those low tier teams as this just widens the gap


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:56 pm 
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fanglord13 wrote:
Throughly despise the expensive mistakes rule after my halfling treasury went from 310k to just 40k :pissed: also, losing 30k from 100k on my vamp team has halted their progress.

Combine this garbage with a re-drafting system that suits longer seasons and teams better at low TV, I foresee a lot disgruntled coaches.

Seriously, redrafting would be ok with a tighter spiraling expenses system and no expensive mistakes as it would do a fairer job of leveling the playing field at the start of each season.

I'm not a power gamer (as evidenced by the 2 teams above), but it's making it less appealing to use those low tier teams as this just widens the gap

This example just proves my conviction that you need to heavily house rule the league rules to make them actually work.
There are some good changes in these rules which give you more flexibility but the randomness of expensive mistakes, is just bad randomness. Your teams long term fate should not be depended on a single dice roll.

My 2 cents.

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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:24 pm 
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fanglord13 wrote:
Throughly despise the expensive mistakes rule after my halfling treasury went from 310k to just 40k
You knew the rule, so you knew the risk, surely?


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:44 am 
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dode74 wrote:
You knew the rule, so you knew the risk, surely?



When it comes to the halflings, I'm not as worried about the actual coin as they don't really need that much money. I'm doing it as an example of how draconian and unfair the system is to low tier/TV teams. People saying that this hurts dwarves are idiots as dwarves only need a small treasury as they don't replace players as often.

This system really hurts Chaos teams that need to be even a moderate TV to be competitive and fun.


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 Post subject: Re: Blood Bowl - the full list of changes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:49 am 
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El_Jairo wrote:
This example just proves my conviction that you need to heavily house rule the league rules to make them actually work.
There are some good changes in these rules which give you more flexibility but the randomness of expensive mistakes, is just bad randomness. Your teams long term fate should not be depended on a single dice roll.

My 2 cents.


House rules shouldn't be needed, but are clearly going to be required. For example, we have an open league and expensive mistakes and redrafting go against that style of league.

I'm taking a Chaos Chosen team into a new 16 game (plus finals) league to prove that a best case redrafting situation will still massively detriment this team. There is a good variety of teams so far signed up so we should get a clear picture of the obvious short comings of this system by the end of the year.


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