Should fewer tournaments be tiered?

[EastCoast]

I've removed tiers from my tournaments and I'll probably leave them off even when the folks that can see the matrix figure out what they should be. The last two of mine have been won by Undead and Khemri respectively, two teams that have traditionally been at the opposite end of any tiering system. He didn't win but a handy Elf Union player was also running amok with the new sneaky git / dirty player wombo combo last time out.

It's seems (and this is a statement with absolutely no data analysis) like giving pretty much everyone the toys they need brings out a varied field, and we're still at a relatively low-mid "TV". A couple of secondary skills and allowing stacking in the mix means that you can build your Chaos Warriors as well as your Necro Warewolves. I only allow stunties on the star players at the moment maxed at 1 so that takes care of that.

I'm really satisfied with how it's gone for the last few events so the likelihood is I'll maintain it for the foreseeable.

I've heard that certain stars like Hakflem are being over-represented in tournaments and are skewing the balance. Has that been your experience?

[Lyracian]

I've heard that certain stars like Hakflem are being over-represented in tournaments and are skewing the balance. Has that been your experience?

From people I know that have been to a few tournaments it is Hakflem and Morg all over the place

[lyetownmax]

I went to my first tournament a couple of months back, a relatively small affair in Milan - it was chock-full of Morgs.

[lunchmoney]

Highlander rule (There Be Only One) might solve the massive Morg fun.

[lyetownmax]

I really like the Highlander rule, at a stroke it forces people to start looking around for different star player options. I imagine, though, it represents an extra layer of admin for organisers which could potentially disrupt timings?

[Lyracian]

I really like the Highlander rule, at a stroke it forces people to start looking around for different star player options. I imagine, though, it represents an extra layer of admin for organisers which could potentially disrupt timings?

Players should be able to police it themselves.
Player A "My team is Blah & Morg".
Player B "My Team is Eugh & Morg".

Player A "Shame neither of us can use him and he sits on the sideline".

[Barney the Lurker]

I’ve never been a fan of the highlander rule. We can generally agree that the big issues are Morg, Griff, and Hakflem.

This rule will only affect the Morg vs Morg, have no effect vs the others stars, and then if I’m nice and turn up with no stars, the rule does nothing for me and I’ve got to play against all the big nasties.

I prefer the eurobowl route of the star tax with then extra penalties for taking the big stars.

[EastCoast]

Does it tax all Star Players, or just those 3?

[Jayward]

The last draft ruleset I saw had 2 fewer skills if you took one star, 5 fewer skills if you took 2 stars, and an additional tax of 2 skills for Hakflem and Griff, 4 for Morg and Deeproot

[Lyracian]

I prefer the eurobowl route of the star tax with then extra penalties for taking the big stars.

I prefer banning them apart from on the Stunty teams.

[Barney the Lurker]

As a flat solution I think that's fine - although I would limit them to 1.

I'm torn, as I loved stars when they were a bit shit, so still want to use them, but appreciate they are too good on the whole.

[Lyracian]

As a flat solution I think that's fine - although I would limit them to 1.

I'm torn, as I loved stars when they were a bit shit, so still want to use them, but appreciate they are too good on the whole.

I like them in Leagues not Exhibition (tournament) play.

[Mystic Force]

After the debate in this thread I think if I was to organize a tournament in the next few months it would be no stars and no tiers simply so we can get that data needed to help settle things.

The purpose of stars at tournaments for me was that it increased variety, in that it would give the same teams different ways to build with or without a star and for some other teams make them more viable to bring if they were allowed to bring a star that covers something which they lack.

However what seems to have happened is that with the higher availability and reduced cost plus increased power we now have the best coaches bringing the best available team with the best stars. Which means a much narrower set of choices instead of the increased variety which would be the aim.

The point costs for determining the value of said star players is now incorrect in this environment, so we have to some how adjust that costs without just changing the price.

Whilst at the same time we have to adjust for the clear leveling of many teams in the rules. Playing Ogres at a tournament recently (and remember I am not that good) did not feel like playing with one arm tied behind my back, but rather a normal team that has a predictable problem that you just work around and that was without taking any stars. I do not think that is the stunty experience of old.

So in conclusions, things have changed and we are not quite sure how just yet. Many of the predictions before people rolled dice in anger turned out to be incorrect. The people who are good at this game are still good at this game and we do need to have a clearer picture of what is going on before we start editing stuff.

One thing is if the tiers are closer together the amount of "help" a lower tiered team is getting will be less than in the past.

[nonumber]

I've removed tiers from my tournaments and I'll probably leave them off even when the folks that can see the matrix figure out what they should be. The last two of mine have been won by Undead and Khemri respectively, two teams that have traditionally been at the opposite end of any tiering system. He didn't win but a handy Elf Union player was also running amok with the new sneaky git / dirty player wombo combo last time out.

It's seems (and this is a statement with absolutely no data analysis) like giving pretty much everyone the toys they need brings out a varied field, and we're still at a relatively low-mid "TV". A couple of secondary skills and allowing stacking in the mix means that you can build your Chaos Warriors as well as your Necro Warewolves. I only allow stunties on the star players at the moment maxed at 1 so that takes care of that.

I'm really satisfied with how it's gone for the last few events so the likelihood is I'll maintain it for the foreseeable.

I've heard that certain stars like Hakflem are being over-represented in tournaments and are skewing the balance. Has that been your experience?

Not at mine, because I ban them down to max 1 on stunties only. No one else can take them.