Dark Elf effectiveness

Venomous Breath · Post by **Venomous Breath** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 9:35 am

A coach in my league seem to have a problem with the effectiveness of his Dark Elf team. Looking at other rosters he seems to think that the DE's are the worse elven team, and possibly one of the worse teams in the game. I try to explain how good ST3 AG4 players are (especially as some have frenzy), but he is not convinced, especially as DEs aren't that fast.

I would like to know if any of you have had success (or lack thereof) with Dark Elf teams, and whether they seem too weak.

(apoligies if this should have gone on a different board, such as tactics).

Simon

DaImp · Post by **DaImp** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 10:00 am

I have had almost no success with D Elf teams. I have a better record with halflings than D Elves. Not that I could say why... on paper they look like a good team, but I find that the Witchelves constanly get themselves into trouble and cost me turn-overs.
Maybe I have bad luck or maybe I am playing them wrong but to mee they fall in between an agilty team and a strength team, and as a result are great at nothing, but good at most things... not realy the make-up of a championship winning team IMO.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:11 am

4 Blitzers puts them amongst the very best teams IMO.
They did struggle a bit under 4e with the 'must block' Frenzy rules hamstringing the Witch Elves, but under the current ruleset I think they're awesome.
Use Witch Elves in the blitzing role, and develop a couple of Blitzers as recievers.
Our DE team went 10-5 last season under 4e Gold rules. This season I expect they'll go better with the Frenzy change and two more Blitzers. They are admittedly a higher end team (12 games under 3e, 15 under 4e, TR around 280, current roster is up on our site), but personally I'd be happy to start a rookie DE team in any league.
Can't see where your mate is coming from TBH!

Acerak · Post by **Acerak** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:35 pm

I've never seen a bad Dark Elf team. Ever.

-Chet

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:14 pm

For evidence, look at Resurrection if you are comparing.

Dark Elves and Wood Elves ....

But no High Elves. With the new 4 Blitzer allowance, I had 4 new Dark Elf teams sign up for the 2nd season of the MBBL2 ... which makes the Dark Elves the most played team in the MBBL2.

The MBBL2 has seen 133 teams in the league's history. 8 of them have been Orc or Dark Elf. The next closest played race has had only 4 teams in the league's history. Of the 8 played, 6 Dark Elf teams are still active in the MBBL2 (compared to 5 of the 8 Orc teams).

So out of the 80 teams in my league, Dark Elves are the most popular race of the entire league. So I guess I have no idea where your friend is coming from ... my experience is that they are great.

Galak

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:29 pm

Now the one thing I will consider for your friend is that if you are looking at the Dark Elf team purely on a player cost basis ... yeah they got the short end of the stick.

http://www.midgardbb.com/BBTeamCostAnalysis.htm

High Elf: 3 position players costed 10k under actual, yielding 8 position players total with 10k discounts for a team discount of 80k

Wood Elf: 2 position players costed 10k under actual, yielding 6 position players total with 10k discounts for a team discount of 60k

Dark Elf: 1 position player costed 10k under actual, yield 4 position players total with 10k discounts for a team discount of 40k.

However, while I'm a big fan of the math behind player/team creation, the bottom line is that its just a compontent to the overall effectiveness of the team. I would gladly say that the Dark Elves are one of the better teams in BB and might be the best Elf team also (I'm partial to fast elves so the AV 7 Wood Elves appeal more to my play style).

However, if your team is just looking at the stats and the costs and not the mix ... yeah the Dark Elves got the short stick of the Elf teams ... doens't matter though, they still rock.

Galak

Dangerous Dave · Post by **Dangerous Dave** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:10 pm

My personal view is that the Dark Elves are marginally the worst of the Dark Elf teams - however, it is very marginal.

With the addition of the 2 extra blitzers, they are still a strong side.

The reasons I think they are slightly worse.... lack of speed and passing game needs to be developed.

Having said that I believe all the Elf teams are in the top half of the official rosters......

Dave

DaImp · Post by **DaImp** » Sun Apr 21, 2002 3:09 pm

I must admit to never having played a 4ed or 2k1 Dark Elf team so they could be a fair bit more effective now. 4 blitzers and not having to use frenzy is a definate improvement for the team

longfang · Post by **longfang** » Sun Apr 21, 2002 5:29 pm

Just tell him how crap a coach he really is and let him get on with it.

Trambi · Post by **Trambi** » Mon Apr 22, 2002 7:40 am

We will see !
I organize a only dark elf league in my town. I will keep you informed ...

High & Mighty · Post by **High & Mighty** » Mon Apr 22, 2002 2:12 pm

Last season, I lost only two games with my dark elves. Of course, one was the league championship, but we're not bitter.

Under the old rules, I played without a witch elf. My league was bash heavy and so I thought the AV7 and old Frenzy were too much of a liability in that place. But I've bought one now and am trying to develop her. Block with frenzy makes a world of difference (as does having 5 rerolls).

IMO, raw speed, ala Wood elves and Skaven, is overrated. MV 7 allows you score a two turn TD without GFI, and MV 6 with just one GFI. Get some leap on a few receivers you flood the field with and you'll score every time. But no elves have trouble scoring. HE get catchers, but elves are already great catchers so I'd rather give up the catchers and instead get more blitzers, and now witch elves, and have the ability to pop out the ball on D. Once we have the ball, we're on cruise control.

That's the advantage dark elves have. The ability to carry out selective attrition, and live to tell about it.

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Tue Apr 23, 2002 9:24 am

May be that you dont see what is the truly way of playind Dark Elf, change team.
Trambi: There will be good and bad team also...(by the way, Aless and Seb are ok to play it).

Marcus · Post by **Marcus** » Tue Apr 23, 2002 10:03 am

Da Imp: I have had almost no success with D Elf teams

I must admit Darkelves are also my bane. There is no reason I should do badly with them as they are a good team for a style of play I enjoy playing (fluid running game) but I never seem to do well with them.

On the flipside DE teams have been responsible for some of the more unpleasant massacres I have been subjected to in the past. I don't know why, I guess I'm just not a Dark Elf.

High and Mighty: IMO, raw speed, ala Wood elves and Skaven, is overrated. MV 7 allows you score a two turn TD without GFI, and MV 6 with just one GFI.

High MA is not just about how fast you can reach the endzone. It's primarily about how quickly you can redeploy your team to get players where you need them.

Marcus

Norse · Post by **Norse** » Tue Apr 23, 2002 10:16 am

I know the feeling.. Until a few weeks ago, I had never won when using Orcs nor had I ever beaten them when playing against them.. My bane.. now resolved thankfully..

As for DEs, I think they are better that HEs to be honest. I still think WEs are the best of the bunch, but I think DEs are not that bad...

DaImp · Post by **DaImp** » Tue Apr 23, 2002 8:20 pm

All this talk of Dark elves has inspired me to have another go at playing them, so I have decided to run a Dark Elf secondary team in my league - not eligable for league points but able to grow and eran money and SPP points in friendly games.
maybe I will now begin to have some success with them.