Chainsaws and fouling

[daloonieshaman]

got it
on with the foul
If I declare a FOUL! action and move into position, add up the numbers and decide not to make the roll for the foul then there is no foul, but I have used my team turn foul.
If I have a negtrait and roll a 1 there is no foul as I do not roll to foul you, but my team turn foul is used up
If I kickback my team turn foul is used up yet I do not get to roll to foul you

so I would say that even though I wack myself in the head I did not foul you and my team turn foul is used up

[dode74]

This is true, but you cannot roll for a kickback until a target is declared, which I think might be key as to whether a foul (as opposed to a Foul Action) has taken place. It's a bit like dauntless in that sense: you can only roll for dauntless once you are committed to the block, and the block is then thrown regardless of whether you pass the roll or not. With the saw you can only roll for kickback once you are committed to the foul, and an AV roll is made regardless of who it is on.

[daloonieshaman]

Sounds like it may fall under individual commissioner/organizer ruling as opposed to cart blanche

[Darkson]

This allows the player to move a number of squares equal to his MA and then make a foul against an opposing player who is Prone or Stunned and in an adjacent square. The coach nominates the victim, and then makes an Armour roll for him.

If the score beats the victim's Armour value

To reflect this, if the Armour and/or Injury roll is a doubles

(Bolding from me)

From that I'd say the referee is looking only for the victim's AV roll, and the Chainsaw is not the victim of the foul here.
But I agree it's a bit of a grey area, but I believe the intention is as I've put it, and if it wasn't I'd houserule it this way anyway (Goblins hardly need another nerf).

[dode74]

It also says "victim" in the chainsaw description, in the context that the "victim" is whoever is hit by the chainsaw. From the skill description:

Make an Armour roll for the player hit by the
chainsaw, adding 3 to the score. If the roll beats the victim’s Armour
value then the victim is Knocked Down and injured – roll on the Injury
table. If the roll fails to beat the victim’s Armour value then the attack has
no effect.

This suggests that whoever is hit is the victim, and specifically in this case because it is the only time the victim of the foul can change.

I agree that goblins don't need a nerf, but it'd be nice to know what the intent was, or if the situation was considered.

The reason I ask is that in the Cyanide version the player does get sent off in the situation described...

[Darkson]

The reason I ask is that in the Cyanide version the player does get sent off in the situation described...

Should have said that at the start - now we know it's wrong.

[plasmoid]

The chainsaw has to hit something to kick back off of. These things don't actually have a life of their own The only thing it can kick back off is the target or the ground, and in either case a foul has been attempted for that to happen.

I think applying logic to game/skill resolution is definately what you shouldn't do.
That way lies intercept roll after pass roll, and such.

Cheers
Martin

[dode74]

In the absence of clarity regarding the correct course of action there is little else left.

[Glowworm]

I don't think the CS gets sent off.....your rolling double 1 for a kickback armour roll.....not a foul roll as you cannot foul yourself, yes I agree that you use your foul action for the turn but you don't foul, the kickback happens before you have a chance to foul ( say when pulling the cord to start the thing.....if you want to get " real world') but as you've declared the action you lose it.....

Just my thoughts, it's easier when they just kill themselves.......saves all this confusion

[dode74]

Honestly I'm not fussed which it is. My point is that it could be either way both from fluff and from rules perspectives, and it'd be good to know which way it should be.

[sann0638]

My interpretation would be kickback prevents the foul, so no send off.