Necromancers and Star Players

[rolo]

Okay I have to argue with you rolo.

The Necromancer says "after Apothecary use if any" and it clearly says in the rules that the Star Players have their own Apothecary that always save them from death. Not sure how that is argued to not work.

I feel like rules are being interpreted implicitly from fluff.

Counter-argument: If the Star Player's Apothecary is used immediately and "works", why is the Star Player not placed in the reserve box? That's what happens when a normal apothecary "works". Instead, when a Star Player is killed, during any game, they're always "dead" for the rest of the match. And then stapled back together again and available for the next match.
So my thinking is that they should be treated like any other dead player. Specifically, if they meet the criteria for becoming a zombie, I'd say there's nothing in the actual rules which prevents them from being raised as a zombie.

So I guess after the game, the Star Player's trainers grab his corpse and have him resurrected. They'd still be available to be hired in the future.

So what happens to the zombie? There's no rule which covers an Undead or Necromantic team losing a zombie after it's been raised. I think Dode's explanation #3 is an attempt to explain away the paradox.
But for me it's the same kind of hand-waving which lets a Star Player play in two games which are played simultaneously. It just happens. So my Undead team can retain Zombie Griff, but Griff is also still available for hire.

[Darkson]

So my Undead team can retain Zombie Griff, but Griff is also still available for hire.

Which makes zero sense, in either game rules, fluff or real world.

[rolo]

It makes sense in the same way that a Star Player can play in two different games at the same time. Just not two different teams on the same field. This is a fantasy world with wizards and magic; at some point there will be situations which don't really seem to make sense and you just have to shrug and say, "just do what the rulebook says and don't worry about it too much".

Vampires are not destroyed when playing in Very Sunny weather. Skeletons, who do not have a sense of smell, get distracted by a halfling grilling burgers. A Mercenary with Leader has to roll Loner in order to use his own Leader reroll. Sometimes stuff just doesn't make sense.

[Regash]

It makes sense in the same way that a Star Player can play in two different games at the same time.

Trying to argue with logic in a fantasy world... I don't know.
I'm basing my opinion on that "after the apo" thing.
Star Players do have apos and they succeed every time, hence no Star Zombies.

To be honest, I'd have no problem if my opponent created a zombie. He killed a player after all.
And I wouldn't mind him keeping it after the game either. Why would I?
But the question was if it is possible and from what I read in the rules, I'd still say no.

[hissa-lives]

Fumbbl has a similar thing to Cyanide. I killed elf star player, gained a zombie, then after the match his name changed. But still had an extra zombie

[rolo]

But the question was if it is possible and from what I read in the rules, I'd still say no.

Just reading the rules, and totally ignoring the fluff, it's pretty obvious that you (somehow or other) get a zombie:

Instead of purchasing an Apothecary, Necromantic and Undead teams use the services of a Necromancer. The Necromancer is free to the team and allows the team once per a match to 'Raise the Dead'. If a player on the opposing team with Strength 4 or less that does not have Regeneration or Stunty is killed during the match (after Apothecary attempt if any) then the team may immediately place a new Zombie player in the Reserves box of their dugout (this may cause a team to have more than 16 players for the remainder of the match). During Step 5 of Updating Your Team Roster (see page 29), you may add this player to your roster for free if you have less than 16 players on the team. A free Zombie still counts at full value towards the team value.

Technically it doesn't even explicitly say that it's the same player - maybe killing someone releases enough necromantic energy that the Necromancer can animate some corpse which he just has lying around. Kill a player, get a zombie.

Using only the Rules as Written:

"If a player on the opposing team with Strength 4 or less that does not have Regeneration or Stunty is killed during the match"
Killed is pretty well defined - rolling a 6 on the injury table. I think the key passage comes next:

"(after Apothecary attempt if any)"
Does the Star Player's entourage count as an Apothecary attempt? I think this is where the ambiguity comes in. To me, this clearly refers only to the actual team Apothecary coaching staff / inducement. There are rules for the apothecary, the "attempt" is a second injury roll, there's a chance that the player in question is placed in the reserves box - and it specifically says that they may NOT be used on Star Players. So the "Guys healing the star player after the game" are clearly something else.

The difficulty comes from the fact that these guys are called "Apothecaries" in what is otherwise (to me) a fluff description of a Star Player's entourage. Is what they do considered an "Apothecary Attempt" in the same sense as what team apothecaries do? I don't think so, but I can absolutely see why some people think it is. The rule is ambiguous, which I think is the OP's original point.