Lizardman Playbook

[garion]

@ Da_Great_MC

I'd like a Skink with Guard to assist a Skink attacking the ball carrier. I also like Sure Hands on a Skink. Therefore I never give Dirty Player. I just don't reach the point where I've rolled enough doubles on Skinks.

I dont like guard on skinks because you have to leave your skink next to an opponent player to use it. They will just die very quickly.

But I might put a bit in about guard Skinks - because they do have their uses when combined with the ball sacking skink.

Surehands can be usefull. But as I said in the playbook block is a more effective choice on your skink ball carrier. If you come up against a player with block/wrestle and tackle sure hands will not make any difference unless your skink already has block. So it is better to take block first and then surehands if you are lucky enough to get a second double on that Skink.

Also I tend to go for a Saurus ball carrier so sure hands is given to that player.

Also, I would never give Sneaky Git as a first skill to a Skink. If he doesn't roll a double skill when he reaches 16 SPP's he becomes very expensive. On top of that: when I foul, I make sure it counts, therefore Sneaky Git very rarely does the trick for me (barring the unlucky double '1' or maybe double '2'... surely not worth wasting a skill on!

Neither do I, the section about dirty player skinks says that if Dirty player is picked as a first skill then sneaky git should be picked as the next roll if they skill up again unless another double is rolled in which case take kick.

Also sneaky git is a good skill because DP is optional so get enough assists on a player so a roll of 6 is needed and if you roll a double 3 opt not to use sneaky git, and your player stays on the pitch. This way your foul will go through the armor 25/36 times and cause you to be sent off 8/36 times. Your opponent will be knocked or worse 2.08 times more often, than you will be ejected.

When optimally fouling with no skill, sneaky git, dirty player or sneaky git+dirty player. AV=the armor of the opponent after adding assists. The numbers = chance of said end event (ejection, opponent getting knocked out, opponent becoming a casualty)
here are the stats.-

ejection prob


damage prob


eject vs damage

I would "never ever" bother with the Hail Mary Skink!

Neither do I, the first sentacne about building this player say I would never bother making one they are an unnesisary TV increase and not very effective.

If you want to build a OTT Skink, you should give him Sidestep first (like all Skinks that don't roll a double skill). Blitzing an opposing player into the Sidestepping Skink will allow him to move into the first square on your opponent's half.

Again I said I wouldn't bother building this player but if I did they do not need side step. All they need is surefeet and sprint so that there is one less push back required in the chain pusing process. Side step isnt needed here and the OTTD can be achieved just as easily without.

Fourth skill should be Catch.

Skinks do not reach their 4th skill unless they have double skills. They get retired after 2 which is also covered in the guide.

Thanks for the feedback though keep it comming.

[Heff]

All I know about lizzies is I struggle to beat them. now it will be harder still
This is a great book

[garion]

Ok so I have read through it again, I will add a section about inducements mainly star players really. Also the skink section does need a little bit of re-wording to clarify a few things also will include a bit about a guard skinks although I dont like them.

[garion]

Ok Star Players added and a little bit of rewording to clarify things in the Skink section.

[plasmoid]

Oh - one more random thought - and I still haven't read it.
I'd be keen on an AG2 saurus if the AG-increase was an early skill.
Like you, I think the team really needs a ball carrier that isn't picked off (or stripped of the ball) too easily.

[nick_nameless]

Grab is a good skill but it is a skill you should only chose late on their development. You need block, mighty blow, break tackle and guard on your Saurii as quickly as possible. Mighty blow is required so you can star gaining spp quickly because these guys are really slow to develop. Grab is quite nice but you do not want to be bouncing your opponents between saurii. In fact you want to keep your saurii on the move at all time and if it can helped free of any tacklezones by then end of turn.

You also say you would like grab for oppening holes in the opponents defence but I don't see how this gives you any big advantage over a normal block anyway to be honest. It is a nice skill but it is a luxary. Block, Mighty Blow, Guard, Break Tackle, Tackle are all absolutely vital and you need these asap.

Fend is a good skill and if your league is full of claw - PO players then taking it can be advantageous but as before there are just too many skills they need before it. All this is covered in the playbook. I will look at putting more in about grab though if i feel it is needed, I will read it again later today.

Also what does WRT mean?

Thanks for the feedback

WRT = with respect to

[garion]

Oh - one more random thought - and I still haven't read it.
I'd be keen on an AG2 saurus if the AG-increase was an early skill.
Like you, I think the team really needs a ball carrier that isn't picked off (or stripped of the ball) too easily.

Yup that is included. I have included both the ball carrier saurus and the wrestle saurus both are widely debated. I like the ball carrier one and dont like the wrestle one but they are both there.

and thanks for clearing that up for me nick_nameless

[nick_nameless]

Played my first Lizardman game yesterday.

I had already decided that I was going with the 6 Saurus, 1 Krox, 4 skink, 2RR build before I read the guide, and it did not change my mind. I felt like this was the better defensive team and had a better ability to protect the skinks. From what I have read, killing the skinks off is the way to beat Lizardmen...so I figured my first job was to mitigate that possibility. I also felt like getting maximum opportunity for MVP to land somewhere other than on a skink was a priority. I am happy with the choice so far.

The major technique that I used from the guide (one I have employed before with Dwarves, but a nice strategic point on the Lizardmen nonetheless) was to build a loose screen up one sideline, fronted with Saurii and backed with skinks to put TZs on spots where an opponent might try to dodge through. The BC stayed in the middle-back, and I managed to execute a nice whole half TD in the second half. I ended up winning the game 2-1. It was against a Human team that gave me enough inducements to hire a wandering apothecary, which I did not use but was a nice safety blanket.

The one thing that is stated in the guide that I did not end up agreeing with was to "never blitz with the Kroxigor, there is no need to.". There were several times where my opponent had dodged away from him OR where I had knocked down all of his guys around the Krox, and so he needed to be mobile anyways. I blitzed with him several times where I wanted to put another big body on a group of apposing players that were threatening my screen.

I understand it can be a little risky to depend on a bonehead roll for your blitz, but sometimes it is the best thing depending on what's happening in the game. Maybe it doesn;t need to be said, but after playing the game I thought that advice was a little strong.

The most helpful piece of advice, even if it's a little obvious when you think about it, is to run your Saurii in packs. Leave one alone and Nuffle will reward your opponent with the POW he needs to know the Saurus' teeth out.

[garion]

I understand it can be a little risky to depend on a bonehead roll for your blitz, but sometimes it is the best thing depending on what's happening in the game. Maybe it doesn;t need to be said, but after playing the game I thought that advice was a little strong.

That's a good point. I will re-word it when i get round to doing my final draft so it is less strong a statement because sometimes necessity does dictate that a blitz from the kroxigor is the best corse of action. Although you should try not to do it at all if it can be helped. As stated in the guide positioning is key to using your Kroxigor and trying to use him as little as you can.

Out of curiosity which set ups did you use defensively and offensively? And did you find any of the other information in the guide helpfull generally speaking.

[nick_nameless]

I understand it can be a little risky to depend on a bonehead roll for your blitz, but sometimes it is the best thing depending on what's happening in the game. Maybe it doesn;t need to be said, but after playing the game I thought that advice was a little strong.

That's a good point. I will re-word it when i get round to doing my final draft so it is less strong a statement because sometimes necessity does dictate that a blitz from the kroxigor is the best corse of action. Although you should try not to do it at all if it can be helped. As stated in the guide positioning is key to using your Kroxigor and trying to use him as little as you can.

Out of curiosity which set ups did you use defensively and offensively? And did you find any of the other information in the guide helpful generally speaking.

Defensively...

I used a hybrid of Zig/Inverted Zig. I used inverted zig in the wides, but flipped the midfielders structure so that it was like a normal zig. I wanted to protect the middle as a zig does, but I did not want to leave a skink exposed to a 2D block if my opponent managed to open a hole in the line. The way I set it up, the best he could have hoped for was a 1D block on a skink (no players on his team greater than S3)

Offensively I set up with 2 deep skinks and 2 in the mid field. Krox and 4 Saurus on the line set up to throw blocks, and 2 back a bit to wield across the field to set up the initial screen.

My attention span is really low for reading, so mainly I have skimmed the guide. The parts I kept in my mind was to maintain the loose screen so the skinks could work on offense, to run Saurii in packs, and to run a stifling defense that was a shuffling s4 screen backed by skinks, waiting for the other team to get impatient, make a mistake, or have a bad string of dice. Whatever I did, I did not want to give up a quick score.

[garion]

My attention span is really low for reading, so mainly I have skimmed the guide. The parts I kept in my mind was to maintain the loose screen so the skinks could work on offense, to run Saurii in packs, and to run a stifling defense that was a shuffling s4 screen backed by skinks, waiting for the other team to get impatient, make a mistake, or have a bad string of dice. Whatever I did, I did not want to give up a quick score.

They are the main points and the most important ones, especially the offensive and defensive screening. However forcing your opponent to score quickly is generally a good idea. Because it means you will have time to score again before the half is up.

[nick_nameless]

My attention span is really low for reading, so mainly I have skimmed the guide. The parts I kept in my mind was to maintain the loose screen so the skinks could work on offense, to run Saurii in packs, and to run a stifling defense that was a shuffling s4 screen backed by skinks, waiting for the other team to get impatient, make a mistake, or have a bad string of dice. Whatever I did, I did not want to give up a quick score.

They are the main points and the most important ones, especially the offensive and defensive screening. However forcing your opponent to score quickly is generally a good idea. Because it means you will have time to score again before the half is up.

I felt like, at least against a Human team, that I should make him work for the score. I was intent on preventing a score at all if I could, and with him needing to get behind my s4 lines to do it I thought it was a fair chance. At one point I had his human catcher pinned against the sideline with my Krox.

My games are amazing to watch. I am not a dice whiner, but if you ask some of my friends they will tell you that they see some jaw dropping odds come down in my games, and most of the time not in my favor. Needless to say the human catcher made the necessary dodge rolls to get off the sidelines and threaten the score. After my skink blitzed and managed to get a 2D block on said catcher,I rolled a double both down (he had block), and then on my TRR i got nuffled. I imagine I don't have to explain that.

In any event, I thought my strategy was good, and that grinding and preventing a score was better than giving up a quick one.

[mattgslater]

Just downloaded. Will read today and/or tomorrow, reply this week.

[nick_nameless]

One more thing that I thought of WRT the guide...

Several times I left more than 1 space between the Saurii, instead leaving 2 either in a straight line or in a 2:1 diagonal. I know the guide says not to do this. Against a team with no players on the pitch higher than S3 I think that's a breakable rule. I felt like it was more important to be able to cover more ground with my screen than it was to protect against my opponent being able to get 1D blocks.

Again, I think it's situational, but in my case I thought it served the purpose I wanted it to.

EDIT: And typically I did this towards the edges of my screen, where to throw the extra player into the block my opponent had to be taking more than one guy out of position to defend against my advance.

[garion]

One more thing that I thought of WRT the guide...

Several times I left more than 1 space between the Saurii, instead leaving 2 either in a straight line or in a 2:1 diagonal. I know the guide says not to do this. Against a team with no players on the pitch higher than S3 I think that's a breakable rule. I felt like it was more important to be able to cover more ground with my screen than it was to protect against my opponent being able to get 1D blocks.

Again, I think it's situational, but in my case I thought it served the purpose I wanted it to.

I know what you mean, but in a real game the chances of you keeping your defenses perfect all game are slim. but as a general rule it is best not to let them drift apart because they cannot support each other so well. At rookie status you are more likley to get away with these things but as the teams in your league develop ( they will likly develop fast than you as well) it will cause you more problems.