LRB 5 Starting League Rosters

[mattgslater]

Not much has changed with Undead, in terms of initial changes. The economics are different, but the new teams can afford all the stuff they need. Long-term, things change a lot, as eventually you'll want to add Skels to the mix if you're facing a lot of Claw.

[The Dazzler]

I'm falling in love with this Orc roster:

4 Black Orcs
4 Blitzers
1 Thrower
1 Goblin
1 Troll
2 Re-Rolls
10k banked

This list kicks booty. Two BOBs and a Troll constitute perhaps the nastiest d-line (GC-for-GC) in the game, and this team has lots of 2TTD potential to boot. The Goblin makes a scary safety on a team that doesn't need him to throw blocks, and combos well with the Troll in all sorts of ways (TTM is obvious, but the Gob is great for negating Really Stupid and engineering 3d blocks with the Troll). Moreover, all the ST4 and Block/S access on the team makes it hard for opponents to get their Tackle players on him, making Goblins on Orc teams much less vulnerable than you'd think ...

Finally! A good Orc Roster

[mattgslater]

Funny enough, since I posted that (and yes, I still like that roster), I've been playing a much more conservative build: 4 Blockers, 4 Blitzers, 3 Linemen, 3 Re-Rolls, AC, CL, 10k banked.

Wanna be cheesy? 4 Blockers, 4 Blitzers, 3 Goblins, 4 Re-Rolls. Don't protect the Goblins, don't replace them, heck maybe even just fire them all after one game (or just fire one or two, whatever). Doesn't matter: eventually you can afford Linos, Troll, whatever, and until then it's Journeymen all the way down.

[The Dazzler]

Hi. That conservative build of yours, no Thrower to start?

We're about to start an 8 game League

[mattgslater]

Thrower is fine. AV9 and an all-but guaranteed Apoth after the first game, vs starting Sure Hands. Had success with both.

[The Dazzler]

Cheers Matt.

I'm putting together a Greebo Orc team and as i have the Thrower and a Troll ....

[petitgars]

Does anyone has already try humans without blitzers?

(Like this:
1 Ogre
1 thrower
2 catchers
8 linemens (12 players)
4 rerolls
1 apo)

[spubbbba]

Does anyone has already try humans without blitzers?

(Like this:
1 Ogre
1 thrower
2 catchers
8 linemens (12 players)
4 rerolls
1 apo)

I haven’t heard of anyone trying that, Blizters are a bit overpriced but are still the best players by a long shot.

The only advantage I could see would be skilling up linemen more easily since they’ll be doing more blocking and scoring as well as having a 2/3 chance of getting the MVP. Throwers and catchers tend to skill up quickly anyway so don’t really need the help.

It may be viable in a TV match based environment where you could hoard cash and recycle linemen until you got some with doubles then fire the normal ones and buy 4 blitzers in 1 go. But that’s not much use in a league.

Otherwise you just look to be weakening the team when they are at their most competitive.

[JaM]

I wouldnt mind playing humans without catchers, but blitzers are really players you shouldnt leave out of your (human) roster.

[mattgslater]

No way I'd go without max Human Blitzers at any TV.
1) Against rookies and the like, Strength is King. Blitzers get Guard very quickly.
2) Against rookies and the like, Block is Queen. Blitzers give you four of it, right off.
3) At any level, at least one B-T-POMB is the Ace. Human Blitzer? 3 normal rolls on a MB hunter, 6-12 games. Human Lino? Heh, two doubles in four skills, just this side of prohibitive. Prolly take Guard instead on that first double: that track goes on forever, isn't contingent on more doubles, and if he gets so lucky, he's happy to take Dodge, SS, DT, whatever Nuffle gives him. Ogre needs doubles too, and you don't want him PO'ing anyway. Only a Blitzer.
4) As they develop, the bargain gets better. A Blitzer with POMB or G/MB or whatever two S skills is the same price as a (rather rare) Lineman with the same skills, with one more potential improvement, less time to build, better skill access going forward, and free +MA.
5) You need a good spread of key skills to compete above rookie TV. You can't take them with linos, except on doubles. Imagine an AG3 elf team that can't take Dodge or SS or whatever. You have to have that killer piece and those mobile Guards, or you'll suffer. I find I like to have at least 4 Guard on the pitch at all times, meaning I want 5 on the team. That and a Dauntless gives me the ST I need to bash on bash: people will tell you Humans play to their opponent's weaknesses, but that only works if they can't overwhelm you with their strengths. Done right, you're giving about as good as you're taking on the heavies most of the time, but moving faster and making better use of your removal power.
6) The only time they don't punch their weight is as raw rookies on developed teams. But... they're MA7 and Block. Carry with them, and problem solved!

[petitgars]

First, i do not play every time against rookies.
Second, it don't want to play with guard, bloc, tacle, mighty bowl, and so on. It bores me. I can do it with others teams like dwarf, amazons, and so on. But it also bores me with thoses teams. I prefer use wrestle, and passing skill, and so on (I actually play vamp, so without passing skill actually). It is a choice. And, in this choice, no urgent need of strong ability, so no need of blitzers. I do not want to have a low Team Value with some linemen-false-blitzers , i want to have fun. I know it is not the better option with option...
Yes, it is a kind of ag3 elf team, but with rolls, apo, and av8. Maybe i 'll try it next year. Depend on result of tournament. I think I will try it before at the Lutèce Cup turnament, with Puggy starplayer.

[spubbbba]

First, i do not play every time against rookies.
Second, it don't want to play with guard, bloc, tacle, mighty bowl, and so on. It bores me. I can do it with others teams like dwarf, amazons, and so on. But it also bores me with thoses teams. I prefer use wrestle, and passing skill, and so on (I actually play vamp, so without passing skill actually). It is a choice. And, in this choice, no urgent need of strong ability, so no need of blitzers. I do not want to have a low Team Value with some linemen-false-blitzers , i want to have fun. I know it is not the better option with option...
Yes, it is a kind of ag3 elf team, but with rolls, apo, and av8. Maybe i 'll try it next year. Depend on result of tournament. I think I will try it before at the Lutèce Cup turnament, with Puggy starplayer.

If you like the passing game then High Elves (or Wood Elves if you want a big guy) are a much better choice. You’ll get the same movement along with better agility and access to AG skills, High Elves key disadvantage compared to humans is the lack of strength skill access that the 4 human blitzers have.

By not taking the Blitzers you risk getting beaten up by every non-tier 1 team. Catchers will reduce your average strength whilst the Ogre can be unreliable with bonehead, loner and no block. So you risk elf teams not only matching you for speed and outclassing you in agility but also beating you up and humans really suffer when down players.

3+ rolls with free skill re-roll may look reliable but they always seem to fail at the key time, plus you’ll burn through re-rolls very quickly if your linemen are making a lot of dodges.

[mattgslater]

To each his own. I play silly Pact on tabletop, so I totally get it.

I think format really matters. In very large open perpetual formats, like FUMBBL B and R and Cyanide FOL and MM, "fun" teams usually aren't: everything has to punch its weight all the time or it just fails and dies. So you settle for "your" blend of the same ol' tracks, plus maybe one gimmick per team. In a tabletop league, the competition may not be so value-myopic, and you might have a lot more liberty to play exotic builds.

[petitgars]

mattgslater +1
I am not a rookie. I have ever player in league (in the order) Hight Elves, Dwarf, Orc, Khemri, Ogres, and now Vamp'. In turnament: hobbit, gob, nurgle, vamp, but also norse, or woodies, and so on.

At the beginning, i wanted to play a roster like in eyeshield 21: one big guy, one thrower, one catcher, at the beginning -and no more. Woodies seems goods for that (treeman = better lineman, catcher = faster player than human catcher), but in my opinion, they can't play without wardancer; treeman, +wardancer(s) + both thrower and catcher = 0 or 1 rolls. I don't like it. I prefer 3+reroll and more solid players. First tests with thoses humans are not disappointing. Yes, you often failed. But you try more risky actions, because you can loose 1 or two players on the field, and you have rolls. So you often failed, but you try more
But it is possible that is not a valuable roster. I have to test more. Don't have the time now (maybe play offs for the vamp' team :p).

I'm a bit surprised to see that nobody test that before. Yes it is foolish, but i 'm not the only one?

[mattgslater]

I see that sometimes in TT. Tree, 2 WDs, 3 Catchers, 5 Linos. Doesn't work very well, in my experience. Very boom/bust, but more bust than boom.