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 Post subject: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:08 am 
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Hi all, here's a grand question for you:
Is an AG6 Vampire worth the money or just an unnecessary TV bloat?

BACKROUND: I'm playing in a small 5 player league, two matches against each (so 8 matches total). The league consists of:
Vampire (me), Human, Nurgle, Chaos Pact, and Sea Elves.
Just played my 3rd match (2 wins, 1 draw), so 5 matches to go. Roster is attached.

My AG5 Vampire just rolled 5+6 on his second skill-up, and while I'm leaning towards survivability in the form of Block or Dodge - or maybe even Leap for the aggressive play(?) - AG6 does sound oddly tempting. It'll make him able to go places where no other can go and make him a super-gazer, but I reckon it'll also make him quite the target...

So, hive-mind, share your wisdom with me! :D


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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:37 am 
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I can see the appeal of AG6, but I don't think it's worth the TV. Especially in such a short league and AG5 is more than enough. Vampires needs so many skills. I'd say go with dodge in this case. I go with block first for my first vamps, but with AG5 dodge seems like the best choice.

Good luck with the team!

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 1:23 pm 
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I'd say go for it. They are a bad team anyway, maybe (well, surely!) AG6 makes it easier to go places and gaze people.

F*** the TV! :) No need to optimize this team: otherwise you'd be playing Elves of some sort.

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 2:31 pm 
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JaM wrote:
F*** the TV! :) No need to optimize this team: otherwise you'd be playing Elves of some sort.


That's exactly why you have to optimize you TV, because they are bad and lack skills.
By giving up 40k for something you'll barely use isn't my idea of fun. He can gaze on a 2+ as it is with AG5 and that's enough.
Gazing in a TZ and then getting hit the turn after isn't worth 40k in TV.

If you'd like to go for a fun skill I'd go for leap.
Sensible, then dodge.

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 3:02 pm 
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Dodge into a cage on a 3+, punch the ball carrier for two dice

Gaze someone in on a 2+ (even if in a tackle zone)

Throw the ball like a demon

Pick the ball up in two TZs on a 2+

Pass it away on a 2+

Revel in your monstrously amazing vampire

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 3:23 pm 
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Twelfman wrote:
Dodge into a cage on a 3+, punch the ball carrier for two dice

Gaze someone in on a 2+ (even if in a tackle zone)

Throw the ball like a demon

Pick the ball up in two TZs on a 2+

Pass it away on a 2+

Revel in your monstrously amazing vampire


I don't think you should base your plan on that. Remember, you're relaying on actually getting the ball lose in the first case and this is a team without block and wrestle.

Also, without any defensive skills, the vampire will be a high target and can be taken out quite easily.

AG5 is still great!

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 4:27 pm 
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AG6 does not improve passing.

It is fun to play with a player with AG 6 since he become so versatile, but it feels like all those situational things you can do because of it vampires can do anyway with creative gazing. I would prefer AG 5 and then move faster along dodge, block, sure hands/side step.


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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 6:13 pm 
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I agree mostly with what everyone is saying about AG6 (and I think we talked about this in Episode 3 of Two Dice Uphill - Shameless Plug), but I'd probably take it just so that I could talk about that one time I had this AG6 player that did these awesome things.
I don't always play the optimal strategy, though...sometimes I just want to throw stuff against the wall and see how fun it is.


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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 7:45 pm 
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Thanks for the replies, guys!
I understand all your arguments - which is probably why I was struggling in the first place... :roll:
AG6? Maybe not the best choice, but legendary!
Dodge? Probably the best choice, but rather boring.

Maybe I should just go for Leap as an alternative? Even if I don't use it the whole match, it'll still be a major headache for the opponent constantly trying to screen his ball carrier against an AG5 ST4 leaper! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:09 pm 
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I am a strong supporter of Pro on vampires, but less so in such a short season.
None of the teams are particularly good low TV teams.
If you are playing vampires in such a short league, I doubt you care about the most optimal choice.

Take the +AG. I think the +AG will make you almost as mobile as the leap with MANY other capabilities.
(Giving your opponent a target can also be used to your advantage.)

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:40 pm 
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Tough decision only in that my fave vamp team all took leap first.... Funny to kick short and have a flying vamp throw the ball back to another vamp... thus the offense finds themselves immediately on defense and in trouble.... However, when will you ever get another chance at Ag6.... The fairy coaches wouldn't refuse it.... :P

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:46 am 
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With only 5 matches to go, you should definitely pick Dodge. AG5 is great for dodging but only with the Dodge skill. 15 spp's for the next skill is too much and even at 3 skills your vamp would be better as a +AG blodger (four skills is beyond that vamp anyway at this point).

That vamp is still a cage breaking threat even with Dodge and your opponent already has to plan for gazing. Overall you're much better off gazing with AG5 and blitzing with a Block vamp or a Wrestle thrall.

Dodge is the best pick. You said it yourself. Nobody will pat your back for taking Leap (a "fun" skill") and then losing the next match.


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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 8:54 pm 
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I'm curious el Superbeasto, what did you pick?

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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 10:40 am 
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No doubt, take leap!!!
Not because you want your unskilled AG5 player behind your enemy's line, but because you can have him everywhere and your enemy knows it! give him mighty blow later, Duck the reliable skills. If your enemy knows that you have an ST4 AG5 leaper vampire in the middle of the board, he will have to protect/hide their key player, so he will have his key players too far to capitalize your (common) errors/catastrophic blood lust or he will need extra players to protect his valuable ones. So with a skill, even if you don't use it, you are "neutralizing" some of his players. Obviously, apart of that, you can actually use the skill and has a 2+ hypnotic gaze 2+ jump ST4 beast wherever you want him, in addition your player will have a massive target in his face, you can think that is bad, but that means that probably he will forget to hit that squeeze thrall and he will prefer to risk to the big prize, if you defend your star player properly it will reduce the amount of block that the rest of your team will receive (and trust me, you cannot afford to take too many blocks with your thralls)

PS: If you want to win games give him dodge, if you want to have extreme fun give him jump. I cannot see any reason for giving AG6 to a player unless that player has all the skills he needs or you have good catchers and you play the pass game (and both options are far from your situation)


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 Post subject: Re: AG6 Vampire worth it??
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:44 am 
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El_Jairo wrote:
I'm curious el Superbeasto, what did you pick?

Sorry - I've been away on travels, so I've completely overlooked the replies. Thanks to all of you for your responses!

Due to the above mentioned travels, I didn't get to play with my team again till yesterday. I went with... *DRUM ROLL*... Leap!
I pretty much agreed with everybodys thoughts. +AG was the heroic choice, Dodge the safe/optimal choice, and Leap somewhere in between. So I went with Leap for the fun factor in it. And it paid off! I was ahead 1-0 and on the defence, when the vampire (Sylvania Stallone) lept over an ogre (I played agains Chaos Pact), knocked down the dark elf holding the ball, dodged into a tackle zone to pick up the ball, dodged away, and made a run for it. He ended up scoring as well, thereby pretty much securing the victory for me. :D

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