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 Post subject: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:32 pm 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:03 pm
Posts: 5
Hi all,

I am having some problems with my underworld team during it's second league. I'm afraid I haven't developed my players as I should have. I'm lacking a clear way to score, and I have absolutely no idea of what players I should put on the LoS. Goblins with Foul Appearance + Troll on defense?

This is my team at this moment:

Troll - Block, Claw, Tentacles
Stormvermin - Mighty Blow, Tackle
Stormvermin - Mighty Blow, Guard
Linerat - +AG, Block, Dodge, Two Heads
Linerat - Nothing
Thrower - Accurate (I know it's an awful first choice. I regret it every day)
Thrower - Nothing
Goblin - Two Heads
Goblin - Two Heads, +MA
Goblin - Two Heads, Big Hand, -1MA
Goblin - Nothing
Goblin - Nothing
Goblin - Nothing

The linerat with +AG, blodge, 2 heads, is the main ballcarrier. The first skill was +AG, so I decided to develop him for that duty, but I wish I had a ballhawk.

I don't seem to hurt enemies as much as I think I should, and my plays are rather chaotic...
Well, I don't really know what to do with these guys!


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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:45 pm 
Super Star
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Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 10:38 am
Posts: 801
Heya, Underworld are as a whole pretty bad a lot of the time, and some of the "issues" that you're having have no easy solution.

Troll goes on the line always. I'd try to get him Guard as soon as you can. On defense, your two most expendable players stand next to him. Against a player with lots of Block and Tackle, that's probably your rookie lino and thrower. Otherwise rookie goblins. And expect to lose them often.

The way to score is exactly what you're doing; pick up the ball with your awesome linerat, and slowly move forward until he can break for the end zone. He's clearly your best player anyway.
When you have to score quickly, he's a receiver. Pick up the ball with your Accurate thrower and sling it out to him. Animosity isn't an issue for skaven-to-skaven passes.
The one-turn score play is only for when you only have one turn.

Good luck, Underworld are a tough team to coach.

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:38 pm 
Super Star
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Joined: Wed Mar 22, 2006 11:40 am
Posts: 977
Location: Chorley, Lancashire
If you get a double on one of those goblins with two heads I would go with guard, it is amazing.

With underworld I have found that to score quick to limit damage helps and then pressure the ball constantly on defence.

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:11 pm 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:03 pm
Posts: 5
Thank you very much for the quick and accurate answers.

I guess I really need guard on the troll. Block MB Claw will help me get there soon, I hope.

About the double on goblins...isn't it better to build a horns, wrestle, 2 heads goblin cageburster?

And regarding the players on the LoS...I usually use rookie goblins, but they get stomped easily and I find myself outnumbered as soon as the game starts, that's why I was thinking about Foul Appearence...to give those weaklings a chance to stand it's ground :orc:

Thanks again!


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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:03 pm 
Experienced
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Joined: Fri May 31, 2013 1:52 am
Posts: 153
Underworld is a difficult team. One of the coaches in my TT league does play them well. One thing he does different than suggested above is he does not put the troll on LOS. He keeps him back so he can control where the tentacles go.
My one other suggestion is side step for the LOS. FA stops one in six hits, but SS stops being pushed sideways until you are knocked over.

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 8:21 pm 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:03 pm
Posts: 5
That's actually a very good idea, and you can get more benefit from it than from Foul Appearance overall...


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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:36 pm 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:03 pm
Posts: 5
What Star Players and inducements do you consider best for UW?
I've tried Bomber and Glart without too much success...


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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:42 pm 
Emerging Star
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Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:24 pm
Posts: 358
Skitter is the best.
Fezglich can be very useful and is cheap.
Glart is good as well, when you have already Skitter. Skitter is a must have.


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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:42 pm 
Legend
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Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:59 pm
Posts: 5159
Location: Driving around Bournemouth, south UK
I've had great success with Skitter. He's an annoying creature :)

The speed is great, the occasional stab, and the shadowing & prehensile tail combo is awesome!

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:58 pm 
Super Star
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Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 10:38 am
Posts: 801
The biggest downside to Skitter is that it's so easy for him to score that he can stunt the growth of your permanent players.

But often, realistically if you're getting that kind of inducement, your options might be "score with Skitter" or "don't score".

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:36 pm 
Emerging Star
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2003 6:37 pm
Posts: 435
My last league team had a rather annoying goblin with 2 heads, horns and wrestle. Great for pressure on the ball ;)

However, I'm leaning towards having goblin ballcarriers (and seeing how this goes). One of the problems with a skaven ball carrier is that you've then got additional ST2 players having to run screens. If the opponent has leaping players, things might be different (go back to a skaven with the ball again) but that extra ST3 player screening, plus the access to M skills on goblins, means that you don't have to worry (too much) about skilling them up. You're also a bit better against column defence too (the last break can be done with 3+/2+ dodges with the ball carrying gobbo!

I developed this thinking, as in fumbbl I've an AG4, -AV linerat. He's the best ball carrier, but a bit of a liability, due to his armour, plus a first skill of wrestle (he's being fired after I get round to playing with the team again...). It just made me wonder why I was using ST2 players to try to avoid getting the linerat injured? Its just attempting to hide him away. It might be better to get a standard rat and use him to provide the screen, as he will be better at it than a goblin.

On other points above, I tend to go with goblins on the front on D, with Troll and a goblin behind (thrown goblin is great for messing up an opponent/getting a blitz result on ko table) and skaven at the back to sweep up.

A block, claw, tentacles troll sounds ace. Great for multi-tasking.

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 2:38 pm 
Star Player
Star Player

Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 5:05 pm
Posts: 738
On the Troll, that's great you had block on him
Claw is an obvious choice as well
But i would have gone for Guard first, before Tentacules


Concerning your stormvermin, i see no bad choice here, i'm used to have a killer one, and a more block one (with guard)

you have a wonderfull runner with your linerat!


your problem is imo, to skill the other rats (be lucky, that you have skilled both your vermins already)
The 2nd limeman will need wrestle
normally, wrestle is always my first skill choice on lineman, but with +Ag on the 1st one, i would have done the same...
i would retire the accurate thrower (no need that this), and developped one the thrower as kick+leader+block(as 3rd skill) and the 2nd one with wrestle or block



Concerning, the los, simply put the not skilled yet goblins first (who cares)
and depending of the opponent, put the troll or not (if you are facing a clawpomb or a fouling team... don't put the troll there... just goblins


i have tried once the spam on foul apparence : it seems not improve the life-time of a goblin on the pitch compare to a two-head one

due to the two-head (and horn) easy access, i think wrestle is the best double on goblins

Rolex wrote:
Skitter is the best.
Fezglich can be very useful and is cheap.
Glart is good as well, when you have already Skitter. Skitter is a must have.

+1

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 Post subject: Re: Underworld issues
 Post Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 2:20 am 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:03 pm
Posts: 5
Wow guys, thank you so much for all of your comments and advice, really. They are helping me a lot. I will consider that Thrower build, babass, it sounds great.
I always pick secret weapons star players, but you are making me see Skitter with new and improved eyes!

Today, my Blodge, +1AG, 2 Headed linerat leveled up again...(7th mvp), and I don't know what to get. He is the ballcarrier 95% of the time. Normal roll. Big hand? Horns for sacking? Sure hands? Why won't this rat stop getting mvp's....!?


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