Taking Underworld to my first tourney: advice welcome

[TheKiltedStranger]

If this isn't the right place for this, I apologize.

I listened to Three Die Block's Underworld 3.0 episode, and Nesteroide recommended a few things which I've taken into account. But I have a couple hundred thousand more GP to use than they went into, and this is what I came up with. Like I said, this will be my first Tourney, and I realize that this may not be the most optimal build, but I think it might be fun.

For your convenience (I hope posting this violates no copyright law or whatevs):


Max of 2 extra skills per player, which I've bolded, while the players regular skills are not.
01 - Troll (Loner, Always Hungry, Mighty Blow, R-Stupid, Regeneration, Throw T-mate, Claw, Multiple block)
02 -Blitzer (Animosity, Block, Guard, Tackle)
03 -Blitzer (Animosity, Block, Guard)
04 -Thrower (Animosity, Pass, Sure Hands, Leader)
05 -Thrower (Animosity, Pass, Sure Hands, Accurate)
06 -Lineman (Animosity, Dirty Player)
07 -Lineman (Animosity, Horns)
08 -Goblin (Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty, Two Heads)
09 -Goblin (Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty, Two Heads)
10 -Goblin (Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty, Kick)
11 -Goblin (Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty)
12 -Goblin(Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty)
13 -Goblin (Right Stuff, Dodge, Stunty)

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking maybe I should move the Tackle to one of the Linemen. And I'd try to keep the Guard-Blitzers by the Troll so he could Multi-block/Claw as many poor schmucks as possible.

I get that a few things, especially the troll, aren't ideal, but are they just stupid? Is there stuff I'm not seeing that is obvious to a more veteran player? I really don't know. Any advice would be much appreciated.

[Waldorf28]

My first thought is that your Skaven linerat is way too valuable to risk having sent off. They are a totally different proposition to the Skaven team's linerat - and play a much more pivotal role in the team, often as a runner/ball carrier.

[Pedda]

I'd like to start of saying that I've just started playing underworld myself, to take my advice with a pinch of salt.
Also, it's great that you're going to your first tournament. Regardless of what you take, you'll have fun. Of that I'm sure.

1. I don't think you should give your troll two skills, unless you're allowed to give him a double, i.e. block.
Otherwise I'd leave him with claw.

2. I don't believe that you should foul with your ST3 played and while horns is good, you need a block skill first. I'd give them both wrestle, to sack ball carriers.

3. Accurate is a good skill, but if things goes to plan, you shouldn't be passing. I'd rather have block in a thrower and use him as the ball carrier
(Maybe both throwers, if you can get that extra RR instead of leader and I think that 3 RRs is enough)

4. Kick is a good skill, but I'd rather have wrestle on the goblin, to threaten cages. But, if this is your only double, I'd think about giving the troll block, for reliability.

5. If you follow 2., I'd move that tackle to a linerat, to get those bloggers down on a 4+

[Chris]

Multiple block is a bit of a liability on a player without block and with loner...

Guard though is a fairly solid choice.

Have you considered guard on the troll and then 1 or 2 killer blitzers? Claw and mighty blow? Why not 1 killer and one with horns and tackle? I find with underworld the blitzers are the stars.

Another fun 2 skill combo is 2 heads and big hand on a goblin to scoop up the ball!

If you want kick - and you aren't a regular skaven team that loves it... - on a linerat is better as these chaps should not actually be on the line if you can help it!

What are the team creation rules out of interest?

[TheKiltedStranger]

Thank you so much for the replies, they've given me much to think about.

Team Creation rules are (probably should have listed this from the beginning):
1. 1.1 million for team creation (min 11 players, apoth, cheerleaders, inducements, etc)
2. an additional 250k for skills (20k for singles, 30k for doubles)
3. max of 4 repeated skills
4. max of 2 skills per player
5. no stat increases

Troll: What I'm getting from the advice here is that Block is much better for the Troll's survivability, which makes a lot of sense. I'm stickin' with claw, but Multiblock probably isn't going to work out.

EDIT (because I ran out of time at work and I'd like to finish) :

Blitzers: I was thinking Guard to help the Troll with Multiblock, but I get the feeling that that might not be the best use for three of my best players... so Claw and Mighty Blow? I've never had that on someone, so that could be fun. Or I do like the idea of one killer, one "hunter" with Horns and Tackle... I'll think about this. Maybe I'll put that on a linerat.

Linerats: Wrestle on both so they can hunt down ball carriers, which (as my newb brain understands it) negates the need for Block AND Tackle, if you don't mind starting the turn prone. Maybe I'll have enough gold to give one of them Jump up, just for the heck of it. Maybe I'll put the horns/tackle on one of these guys.

Throwers: I'd like to keep the one with Accurate, just in case, but I like the idea of block on the other guy and making him a ball carrier...

Goblins: 2-heads seems to be the way to go with goblins... I don't know where this puts me with money just yet, but Big Hand seems like a good idea too...

[RoterSternHochdahl]

Sounds like you could have 2 Blitzers with Claw AND MB
and a Troll with Block AND Claw

You are going to have a ball ...

[Chris]

Wrestle counters block, tackle counters dodge...

Against a blodger or normal chap wrestle+tackle combination on 1 dice takes them down 50% of the time (75% with re-roll)
Against a blodger Block+horns+tackle combination on 2 dice takes them down 56% of the time (80% with re-roll)
Against a normal chap Block+horns+tackle combination on 2 dice takes them down 75% of the time (94% with re-roll)

[Chris]

Well team wise couldn't turn up with less than 13 players and 3 re-rolls. Wouldn't bother with an apoth. Can you spend the remaining 20k on skills as well as the 250k? Can you get stars? If so getting Skitter Stab Stab is great as it gives you a gutter runner to play with instead of a thrower and re-roll (get leader on the other thrower). I suppose you can save 50k is you rely on a thrower with leader and lose one of the skill allocation. I would be tempted to get leader as the 4th re-roll! Then get a goblin/apoth (always fail for me)/babe (maybe).

So effectively a choice of 12 skills/1 double OR 8 skills/3 doubles OR 5 skills/5 doubles if you want to spend the whole 250k. Of course if you can make savings in skill creation and add them to this it might be an idea...

Other fun builds for underworld are the suicide goblin cage ball sacker - wrestle and strip ball, a 69% chance of knocking the ball loose, with a 90% with a re-roll against a player with str4 or less (with assists ). 60k here through...

[TheKiltedStranger]

No to Star Players, and No to using the any extra of the 1.1 million on skills. My current team-build for using that up is:
6 Gobbos x 40,000 = 240,000
2 Linemen x 50,000 = 100,000
2 Throwers x 70,000 = 140,000
2 Blitzers x 90,000 = 180,000
1 Troll x 110,000 = 110,000
3 rerolls x 70,000 = 210,000
2 tourney-only inducements = 120,000
Which should Total: 1,100,000

The inducements are very flavorful: 1 auto-succeeds on a foul, roll only on the injury table, once per game, without ejecting any of my players; the other "Automatically heals KO’s into Reserves after each drive", which sounds excellent for my squishy goblins.

That second one sounds like if a guy gets KOed on Drive 1, he'll be placed in Reserve at the start of Drive 2, meaning I could use him again on Drive 3? Right? I'mma ask the tournament organizer.

[Digger Goreman]

I wish you the best of luck! However, I fear that injuries to gobbos will figure in more than knock outs... in my short experience.... After five TT league games, I have spent all my treasury on replacement goblins and still field three gits with -St, -Ag, and double nigglings respectively....

Most games are ressurection (elvish concessions, non?), so I assume you get back your players, yet (in game) I wager gob injury removal will haunt your every turn....

Any way to mitigate this...?

[Waldorf28]

I'd be relying on the fact few tourney rosters go heavy on the Tackle.

[Chris]

Can't fault the team selection. 6 or 7 goblins makes little difference Sadly the little buggers get badly hurt more than KO'd, but there you go Always an element of trusting to luck with the team!

So basically you are looking at skill selection. Really the goblins get some wonderful combo skills that are designed to aggravate the opposition. One set up could be:-

8 skills & 3 doubles
Troll. Block and guard. Block for reliability, guard for support. Another option is claw or pro. Do you expect many high armour teams? Having guard though on a big hard piece is tricky for many teams to counter, just don't activate him unless you need to!
Suicide goblin. Wrestle and strip ball! Cage ball knocker lose extordinare
Super elf Goblin. Two Heads and Big Hand. Dodge on a 2+, pick up on a 3+...
Killer Blitzer. Mighty blow and pile on or claw, depending on what teams you expect to face. Claw has the advantage of getting dwarves who will otherwise murder you. Also means you don't have to follow up...
3 skills left - mighty blow or tackle on the blitzer (again depending on opposition - expect enemy goblins or amazons? Get Tackle), then either a second skill on him on a couple of skills on the other skaven. Dirty player would work well on a linerat with your inducement. Maybe sneaky git on a goblin for opportunistic fouling.

[Pedda]

Super elf Goblin. Two Heads and Big Hand. Dodge on a 2+, pick up on a 3+...

Fixed that for you

[Chris]

I see no error

[TheKiltedStranger]

Fantastic! Thanks, everyone, for the advice. I really appreciate it.

I have no idea what other people will be taking... so I'll just build the team and hope for the best!