Should we...

Post by **Thadrin** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 8:28 am

Once this whole classic teams project is done, should one of us write it up as a joint work and try and get them in the Journal?

Would be kinda cool to see a project co-authored by guys in at least four different countries published - and to see our names there wouldn't it?

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:04 pm

The problem is that we are not all agree with those team.
like for Gobbo Catchers or some specific skills on a team....i love most of ideas but there are some i disagree about the convertion so...

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:11 pm

Longshot,

Okay, I'm going to walk through the conversion of the 2E Goblin Catcher and you tell me with which part you disagree.

The most important part of conversion is that you cannot just create a whole new player type ... if the player type does not exist then you must go with what you have.

The other part of conversion is that when a 2E player type exists that does not have a BB2k1 equal you start with the 2E Lineman compare it to the new position and then make those changes to the BB2k1 Lineman.

That said there is no such creature as a BB2k1 Goblin Catcher so first we compare a Goblin Catcher to a Goblin Lineman in 2E.

MA - both have 4
SP - Line +2 / Catcher +3
ST - Line 3 / Catcher 2
AG - Line 3 / Catcher 4
TS - both have 0
CL - Line -1 / Catcher +1
AV - Line 8 / Catcher 7

Okay so now we translate he differences:
1) +1 SP = Catcher gains Sprint
2) -1 ST = Catcher SHOULD have -1 ST, but since that would mean ST 1 for the Catcher we ignore this part of the conversion
3) +1 AG/+2 CL = AG was mainly used for Dodging, CL for catching ... the extra point in 2 of the 3 agility stats clearly equal +1 AG to the Catcher ... in addition the 2 extra CL (catching) points should mean the Catcher also has the Catch skill.
4) Finally -1 AV = straight translation of -1 AV.

Thus in summary, a Goblin Catcher would be a Goblin with 1) Sprint, 3) +1 AG/Catch, 4) -1 AV ..... or ....

Goblin Catcher 6/2/4/6 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff, Sprint, Catch

Now I know one of your points that you raised already was the AV of the Goblin Catcher as you beleived that would mean AV 5 on a Halfling Catcher which didn't seem right. In 2E, the Lineman and Catcher positions on the Halfling team both had AV 7 ... since a Halfling in BB2k1 has AV 6 ... this would seem to even further back the AV 6 of a converted Goblin Catcher.

There is the translation step by step ... let me know where you disagree.

Galak

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:13 pm

It's bloody obvious that not everybody is going to agree with every stat and every skill on every team! The whole idea is to discuss as a group and come up with something that works and is FUN! Once we've got 8 workable rosters, you can always tweak them slightly for your own games.
Chill out!

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 1:13 pm

Oh and if you disagree with anything else on one of the 8 teams ... please tell us ... the whole purpose here is to discuss this and come to a concensus on the teams.

Galak

Anthony_TBBF · Post by **Anthony_TBBF** » Mon Feb 11, 2002 2:41 pm

I think we should try them out before writing anything up as well.

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Tue Feb 12, 2002 5:36 am

i think that the translation can't be used every times. look at Garbage with his AV6 (without block skill), he must have died.
I think that sometime it is much realistic to create the new player position. Dont forget that you are create in 3/4 ED so it must be realistic in there. and seeing those goblin Catcher on a 3/4 ED pitch must be a joke.
sprint instead of MA+1 is a good idea. I've let you the players position we have tryed to make for Gobbo Catcher, and i think they are more appropriate for 3/4 ED pitch than seeing AV6. Just my point of vue.
They are one of the 8 best team and they will be killed their 4 'Catcher in a half-time'.
In conclusion, i prefer to create a new position (to discuss with you) than translate. Dont forget that the way to play is different in 2nd ED if you have played it so translation could get a differente taste on the player and in 3/4 ED .
c ya

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Tue Feb 12, 2002 6:12 am

hi again,
i found a quite good example to make me understood:
it is like a sentence translation to french into english or (spanish, for Ancalagon

)
most of time, the tranlastion word to word is quite good but sometimes that does not make any sense. that's what i feel about it.
for most of thing you've done, the translation is good (and realistic) but in this particular case of gobbo catcher, i think that the tranlation isnt realistic for 3/4 ED.
like you did for Morg in All-Stars, u translated it and so he is differebt than in 3/4 ED and less realistic.
I hope you've understood my way of thinking.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Tue Feb 12, 2002 1:27 pm

Longshot,

Have you ever coached Halflings???

See I've coached Snotling and I've coached Halfling teams in full league seasons. I have to tell you that AV 6 does not equal Death ... far from it.

Your argument is that AV 6 is some super fragile creature that gets squashed immediately. Having coached AV 6 and AV 5 teams that just is not true. There is nothing wrong with the AV 6 on the Goblin Catchers.

Look this is not a case of something begin unrealistic or a mistake in translation. Goblin Catchers had the same AV in 2E as Halfling Lineman and Halfling Catchers. I clearly do not see how this would not mean AV 6 on the Catcher. They as fragile as Halflings ... and again having coached Halfings ... yeah they break occassionally ... but not nearly to the extent that you would suggest.

Galak

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:14 am

i have myself a Halfling team (180tr)
and this is my second season with gobbo in tournament.
I know that they can resist , but i play against players with MB, and more and more take tackle => so i have some nightmare at night.
my gobbo team didnt hade a lot of hurt (1NI and 2 Dead) in 7 games but my halfling had a some more casualties...

Tackle players are our ennemis!!!!

_________________
/me escape of this field before you smach my face down

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Longshot on 2002-02-13 11:15 ]</font>

Post by **voyagers_uk** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:29 am

just an idea, that as well as those people trying out the rosters in Pbem why not try them out at the tourney that Norse and Lucy are organising for later in the year in Amsterdam. Make it sort of a masters tournament with Champions of Old.

I am trying to merely help further our hobby.

Post by **Thadrin** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:35 am

DIBS ON THE GIANTS!

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:02 pm

sorry, what will be in Amsterdam?

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:48 pm

Longshot: Bear in mind that you're still playing 3rd, so MB goes on both armour and injury. Most of us have moved on. Please tell me you're at least using Sigurd's!

Norse · Post by **Norse** » Wed Feb 13, 2002 3:02 pm

Longshot...

myself and Lucy are going to organise a tournament later this year in Amsterdam...

We haven't finalised details yet, but when we know dates etc we will start a new thread asking for people to commit themselves to a visit for a long weekend with a 16 (just a guess??) person tournament or something like that... Should be a lot of fun...