Blood Bowl Rugby

[Stix]

Hi all,

I'm a rugby player and referee who's fairly new to Blood Bowl, and I've been thinking about writing up a rule set for the "game they play in Heaven". I was wondering if there are any full rugby rule sets out there that I could try and possibly adapt. If so, could someone give me a link? If not, have you guys got any ideas that I could test?

[outcast]

Hi Stix, I'm an ex-rugby player (although I'm sure I've still got a couple of games left in me and I share your interest in a rugby themed ruleset based around blood bowl.

When I first read the BB rules I tried to put together a rugby version and I think there are lots of mechanics (tackle zones, dodging etc.) that lend themselves very well. A couple of areas that struck me as difficult to implement were rucks/mauls and the size of board needed to allow 15 players and still allow the creation of space.

That said, I don't think these problems were in any way insurmountable but I parked the idea and then just got into BB as it is.

Would be very interested if anyone else has any rule sets or ideas and would also be happy to help out in trying to put some together if folk were interested.

...As long as I don't have to communicate with any Bath fans

[MattDakka]

Do you know Crash Tackle?
It's not fantasy but it's a rugby board game.

[Stix]

Hey guys, I was looking through the threads last night when I found this one:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2267&p=151300&hilit

I think this is all but PERFECT for a human team we could use. With regards to the back heel skill/trait, I've had an idea that in addition to this, forwards should also be able to attack opponents in the ruck area, effectively trying to clear the out while risking a turnover (and possibly a penalty for going off their feet?).

I've also found some awesome ideas regarding tackling and offsides:
- All players can blitz
- Only the ball carrier can be attacked
- If the tackled player drops the ball and it scatters forward (not sideways), then the opposition have a chance at getting an advantage (any infringement within a reasonable period means no advantage gained, and the play comes back for a scrum)
- Advantage Law can also apply to other infringements such as offside players affecting the play
- At a ruck or maul all offside players have a turn to move into an onside and more organised position
- No offside player may attack or assist

What are your thoughts? Any ideas regarding scrums, mauls, lineouts, etc?

Also, yes, I'm familiar with Crash Tackle (I've been hoping to buy it for a while), and no, I'm not a Bath fan :p

[MattDakka]

What about the pitch?
Do you mean to use the normal Blood Bowl pitch or one with more squares?

[outcast]

I had a read through the thread and there are some great ideas on there. I've been thinking a bit more about it and I thought it might be useful to come up with with a list of all the mechanics we think might need to be covered. Then we can look at which of those may already be covered by BB rules and which will need work.

So, as a starting point, here is what I can think of off the top of my head. It's by no means exhaustive but I was trying to avoid too much details at this stage!

- Pitch size (can we use the BB pitch?)
- Team size (realism i.e. 15 players vs pitch size, turn time etc.)
- Running
- Passing
- Tackling
- Kicking
-- Territory kicks
-- Touch kicks
-- Grubber kicks
-- Drop goals
-- Place kicks
-- Restarts
-- Free kicks
- Scrums
- Lineouts
- Rucks
- Mauls
- Offside
- Knock ons
- Forward pass (could be a result of an inaccurate pass)
- Foul play
- Playing advantage
- Injuries (I think DEAD should be removed!!!)

Is that any help or am I getting carried away with myself?

[outcast]

Do you know Crash Tackle?
It's not fantasy but it's a rugby board game.

I love CrashTackle btw, it's a great game but I like the idea of something a bit more BB'ish in mechanics, too.

[Stix]

With regards to pitch size I was thinking of using a 36x23 pitch (38 including in-goals). That's a 50% increase in pitch size.

Normal kicks and bombs could have 1d3 scatter plus 1 square scatter for every 10 squares distance, and bombs could allow the opposition to move one player under the ball when kicked. Bombs could also have a distance limit of 15 sq.
Kicking for goal could be like kicking in general play, but with a -1 modifier for every 7 sq far and/or wide (imagine a 7x7 box in front of goal where there are no modifiers). There could also be a -1 modifier for drop goal attempts. I've also thought that any player in a 3x3 box directly in front of the kicker can attempt a charge down (one at a time). Like interceptions, this could carry a -2 modifier to an agility roll for success, and a successful charge down causes a 1d3 scatter from the player responsible.

I think the rucking system I suggested would be perfect, especially when players have the option of attacking opposition players in the ruck area. As is mentioned in the rugby team thread, any grounded player in the area can be rucked, and if they end up stopping access to the ball, they could be penalised for not rolling away.

I've also been thinking that for mauls, scrums and possibly lineouts, each coach could work out an average strength number for the forward pack when organising their team (rounded up to the nearest whole number). This could be used for mauling (which I'll explain next) and lineouts (I'll think about that later).

Mauling could be done in the following order:
1) Ball carrier runs into the tackle zone of two adjacent defenders immediately in front
2) Player initiates a maul
3) Player moves a teammate (only if they can) into an adjacent square and rolls with the average strength roll
4) 1=maul collapses, scrum to opposition
Failed roll=nothing happens (two in a row=ball must be used or scrum awarded - same goes if mail stops twice)
Successful roll=maul moves 1 sq, ball also moves 1 sq towards back of maul
6=penalty to attacking team (deliberately collapsed - everyone in maul becomes grounded)
5) Repeat steps 3 and 4 whenever a new player is added.

Thoughts?

[Stix]

Scrums could work like this:
Step 1) Attacking team rolls average strength
1=Attacking team penalised (incorrect binding - roll 1d8 to determine player responsible)
2=Ball lost (start next step with defending team)
3-5=Ball won (start next step)
6=Defending team penalised (collapsing scrum, everyone in scrum becomes grounded - roll 1d8 to determine player responsible)
Step 2) Roll average strength
1=Attacking team penalised (front row standing up)
2=Ball hooked 1 sq towards defence
3-5=Ball hooked 1 sq towards attacking side
6=Defending team penalised (flankers breaking off early)
Step 3) If ball is on no. 8's square, player can pick up or keep trying to drive the scrum. If ball goes past no. 8, it is out and scrum-half can pick up and run or pass (-1 modifier for pick up and pass - opposing scrum-half has followed the ball and has attacking SH in a tackle zone).

Scrum setup is as follows:
A D
7 7
5315
8 22 8
4134
6 6

You may also like to know that I've come up with races for the top 10 rugby nations:
New Zealand - Orcs
Australia - Humans
South Africa - Lizardmen
Argentina - Khemri
England - Norse
Wales - Norse
France - Dark Elves (If I remember correctly)
Ireland - Dwarves
Scotland - Dwarves

What do you guys think about the scrums? Any ideas for the other nations (Pacific nations, USA/Canada, Namibia, Georgia/Romania/Russia)?

[Stix]

Hmm, scrum setup didn't come out right :/
Basically what I meant was have the front row all lined up together, have the locks behind the loosehead and tighthead with a gap between them, the flankers right next to the locks, and the no. 8 behind the empty square.

[Steam Ball]

This?

Code: Select all

 A    D
.7....7
.5315
8.22..8
.4134
.6....6

Use the "code" tag to get typewritter style text. Use dots instead of spaces, and even clearer.

[Stix]

Ah, thanks Steam Ball.

[Stix]

I forgot to mention Italy (goblins).

[outcast]

You may also like to know that I've come up with races for the top 10 rugby nations:
New Zealand - Orcs
Australia - Humans
South Africa - Lizardmen
Argentina - Khemri
England - Norse
Wales - Norse
France - Dark Elves (If I remember correctly)
Ireland - Dwarves
Scotland - Dwarves

No Nurgle?

Some great ideas with the rules so far, although I haven't really had chance to absorb them all yet. What are your thoughts on the breakdown? - tackles, rucking, "entering through the gate" and so on - or was this covered in the other thread? (I may have missed it)

[Stix]

Rules regarding the breakdown, such as "the gate" haven't been covered yet. If you looked at the rugby team thread you'd have found the trait forwards have called "back heel", which allows them to hook the ball back with their heel (which has no chance of failure) instead of picking the ball up. This also allows forwards to hook back players who have found themselves at the bottom, possibly even raking them into a position where they end up stopping the attacking team getting to the ball, and hence being penalised for not rolling. This would work really well in rucks. My thoughts so far on the gate are that it's effectively a box marked by the tackled player and the ball, and that to go through it one must enter this box from a square immediately behind. I also want to give players in the ruck a chance to clear out opponents, which is done simply by attacking them when they're in the ruck box. If a player fails this attack and ends up being knocked down, they may even be penalised for going in off their feet.

I'm actually in the middle of writing up the first draft of the Laws as we speak, so hopefully it'll be easier to understand once I've written it in.