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 Post subject: Sigmar Cult team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 25, 2015 4:06 am 
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So a while a go, I played a game against a vampire team and I took Zara. She performed really well, killing a star vamp (regened though) and I won the game in overtime. My one thought throughout that game though was why don't any other players have Stakes? I find it weird that only 1 player...heck star player has stakes!

I think more players should have stakes so I present you... Angels!

0-16 Angels - 50k- 6/3/3/8 - G/ASP
0-2 Crucifer - 90k - 6/3/3/8 - Stab, Stakes G/ASP
0-4 Arch Angels - 100k - 7/2/3/8 - Block, Dauntless G/ASP
0-2 Demigods- 130k - 8/3/4/8 - Block, Dodge, Dauntless GA/SP

Rerolls- 50k Apothecary- Yes

Team trait- When a player on the opposite team dies, they come back as an angel on your team

This team would be an anti undead team. Dead Bloodbowl stars coming from the heavens to bring the Undead bloodbowl stars to peace, and purify the world from such creatures.

I have no idea how this team would play out. I think the Demigods need some tweaking and I'm not sure about the Arch Angels being ST 2 (but I think that balances them out). Making the Arch Angels ST 3 and removing Dauntless is an idea. Thoughts? I just wanted to see some more stakes in this game tbh. Kill those bloody Undead teams :lol:

(Merry Christmas btw!)


Last edited by mushoomy on Tue Dec 29, 2015 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 26, 2015 11:20 am 
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I agree it's a shame Stakes is so limited! Your bog standard angel should be far better than a normal player, though. An archangel is a supernatural uber powerful being. Plus, Angels don't fit in the BB back story.

If you want more stakes, an interesting route could be a religiously (Sigmar) flavoured empire team, including witch hunters, priests, flagellants, penitents and so on, and bog standard henchmen or zealots as linemen (no big guy).

http://whfb.lexicanum.com/wiki/Witch_Hunter

It'd be a general religious, anti chaos, anti magic, anti undead "flavoured" team (though functionally it's really anti undead, as there are no skills in the game that target chaos of magic). It's also a chance to use some more rarely seen skills e.g. Ball and chain.

Perhaps something like...

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - G/ASP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 3737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 90,000
0-4 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Block, Stab, Stakes - GS/AP - 110,000

- Rerolls 60k
- The team cannot hire a wizard
- Star players: Helmut Wulf, Morg, Zara


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 27, 2015 12:11 am 
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Fold wrote:
I agree it's a shame Stakes is so limited! Your bog standard angel should be far better than a normal player, though. An archangel is a supernatural uber powerful being. Plus, Angels don't fit in the BB back story.

If you want more stakes, an interesting route could be a religiously (Sigmar) flavoured empire team, including witch hunters, priests, flagellants, penitents and so on, and bog standard henchmen or zealots as linemen (no big guy).

http://whfb.lexicanum.com/wiki/Witch_Hunter

It'd be a general religious, anti chaos, anti magic, anti undead "flavoured" team (though functionally it's really anti undead, as there are no skills in the game that target chaos of magic). It's also a chance to use some more rarely seen skills e.g. Ball and chain.

Perhaps something like...

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - G/ASP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 3737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 90,000
0-4 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Block, Stab, Stakes - GS/AP - 110,000

- Rerolls 60k
- The team cannot hire a wizard
- Star players: Helmut Wulf, Morg, Zara


Love the idea of Witch hunters :) think they suit stakes well! I think an Empire team is the way to go. I'm not sure about the penitent though, I don't think it fits this team. Maybe replace the Penitent with priests and have the Penitent as a star player?

If we are going with a priest, we'd need to make it different from the witch hunters. Maybe make the priests ball carriers?

0-2 Priest - 90k - 6/3/3/7 - sure hands, dodge - GA/SP


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 27, 2015 12:37 am 
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Penitents are a common sight in Sigmarite war bands in the fluff so thought they could be an interesting one of (admittedly the ball and chain part is a bit of a stretch, and one could easily imagine that flagellants cover the penitent role already... I do like the idea of him being a star player).

I tried to include priests but couldn't think of a role for them. They don't strike me as agile ball carrier sorts. In fact now I think about it some more, if anything Sigmarite Priests are probably the blockers/blitzers - after all, they are described as "warrior" priests and generally are to be found wielding huge hammers in battle!

Perhaps that argues for a team more like this:

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - G/ASP - 70,000
0-2 Warrior Priests - 7338 - Mighty Blow - GS/AP - 90,000
0-2 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Stab, Stakes - GA/SP - 90,000

...going for mighty blow on the priests rather than block as a starting skill for a bit more interesting variation from the norm.

In this version the witch hunter is a more agile, stabby sort of character, relying on his wit and equipment more than brawn, hence the removal of starting block and addition of A access.


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 12:18 am 
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After looking at your ideas, I would go:

Sigmar Cult Teams:

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - GS/AP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - G/ASP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 3737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 80,000
0-2 Warrior Priests - 7338 - Block, Mighty Blow - GS/AP - 100,000
0-2 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Stab, Stakes, Pro - GA/SP - 100,000

Rerolls: 50K
Apo: Yes
When playing Sigmar Cults and against them, you cannot hire a wizard.

... I think the ball&chain is a good idea, so they get a little more (unreliable) strength.
I have beefed the team up with more S access across the board, to put them closer to tier 1. A veteran Sigmar Cult is a fighting machine.
Witch Hunters have gained 'Pro' - they dont strike me as the best blood bowl players (they dont start with block or dodge), but they are very very good at their job and is an elite player type.

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Last edited by Bakunin on Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:06 am 
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Thanks Bakunin. I understand you tend to prefer making new teams tier 1 so this would fit that bill. For casual gamers, making the linemen and blitzer roles strictly better than their standard human equivalents would raise a few eyebrows. So if a casual player wanted their Sigmarite priests to start with block as well then they ought to cost 110,000 - and I'd drop strength access from the linemen. I do like the addition of pro on the witch hunters though, both from a background perspective and to somewhat make up for the lack of block - and they seem reasonably priced at 100k.


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:28 am 
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Fold wrote:
Thanks Bakunin. I understand you tend to prefer making new teams tier 1 so this would fit that bill. For casual gamers, making the linemen and blitzer roles strictly better than their standard human equivalents would raise a few eyebrows. So if a casual player wanted their Sigmarite priests to start with block as well then they ought to cost 110,000 - and I'd drop strength access from the linemen. I do like the addition of pro on the witch hunters though, both from a background perspective and to somewhat make up for the lack of block - and they seem reasonably priced at 100k.


You have a point about the linemen. Priests at 110k seems okay with a 10k after price bump - Block and MB is a good starting combo.
So:

Sigmar Cult Teams:

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - GS/AP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 3737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 80,000
0-2 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Stab, Stakes, Pro - GA/SP - 100,000
0-2 Warrior Priests - 7338 - Block, Mighty Blow - GS/AP - 110,000


Rerolls: 50K
Apo: Yes
When playing Sigmar Cults and against them, you cannot hire a wizard.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:50 am 
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I think it's a really cool team - might actually make it!

Minor quibbles - background wise I don't think a team including witch hunters should ever employ a wizard. It is a big drawback though - so if you made it an absolute ban, how about making apothecary's cheaper? On the basis that the cult includes lots of priestly healers? Would that be too powerful?

Also realised your penitent is 10k less than mine. I think that's sensible -
I'd added 20k to a goblin fanatic for removing stunty but maybe stunty is only a 10k drawback (especially with no hands and S7)


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:14 am 
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Fold wrote:
Quote:
I think it's a really cool team - might actually make it!

Minor quibbles - background wise I don't think a team including witch hunters should ever employ a wizard. It is a big drawback though - so if you made it an absolute ban, how about making apothecary's cheaper? On the basis that the cult includes lots of priestly healers? Would that be too powerful?


I think you just even it out, with a ban on all wizards when the sigmar cults are playing. You cant get one, but your opponent cant either. A rookie Sigmar Cult lose out - but the high TV Sigmar Cult gains a big advantage

Quote:
Also realised your penitent is 10k less than mine. I think that's sensible -
I'd added 20k to a goblin fanatic for removing stunty but maybe stunty is only a 10k drawback (especially with no hands and S7)


The only thing 'stunty' does on the 'goblin ball&chain is make a injury roll of '9' a BH. So the the discount should not be that big. So 80k seems reasonably.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 5:31 am 
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Fold's list is pretty good I think. It's well worked out.

(I much prefer the original one).


Last edited by harvestmouse on Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:02 am 
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Fold - how about making the priests 0-4 and 5339 with dauntless and stand firm? Might eat into the flagellants a little but that would fit my concept of heavily armoured "shield of the weak" type priests.

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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:05 pm 
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Stand Firm is a pretty characterful skill for them, good idea. Personally I'd not infringe on the flagellants by giving them Dauntless as well though.


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 Post subject: Re: Angel Bloodbowl team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 3:28 pm 
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Personally, I think you're running the risk of over describing them. I like the first list. I think there could be room for a crazy lino....but as it is it's fine. Adds new elements, describes humans well and fits the theme. My advice stick with it.

Crazy lino would be maybe give them all stakes. So they could be evicted........first for a roster, but not overly powerful. The problem is how they'd interact with undead teams, they'd avoid them like the plague.......dead plague that is. It would have worked better with lrb 4 stakes I guess....If it were for TT, then you could add a rule for them.


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 Post subject: Re: Sigmar Cult team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 9:40 pm 
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Great discussion guys. Personally I like the look of this.

Sigmar Cult Teams:

0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless - GS/AP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 3737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 80,000
0-2 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Stab, Stakes, Pro - GA/SP - 100,000
0-2 Warrior Priests - 7338 - Stand Firm, Mighty Blow - GS/AP - 110,000

Rerolls: 50K
Apo: Yes
When playing with Sigmar Cults or against them, you cannot hire a wizard

Love the idea of Pro on the Witch hunters, and the stand firm of the priests. The removal of the wizard inducement is a good addition as well. Personally I see stakes on all the linemen just crazy, but it could work if we went into the idea in more depth.

I still don't like the idea of a Penitent on the team. If anything, I think a Penitent would be a similar player to the Dwarf Deathroller, which is an expensive piece of machinery to field. Although Penitent is common in the warhammer universe I think it'd be less common on a bloodbowl pitch. Or (instead of making it a deathroller-esque player), increase the price, keep the ball and chain but increase movement and add another skill (grab, stand firm or mightyblow).

I think we've ditched the idea of Angels, so I've changed the post name ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Sigmar Cult team - Stakes
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2015 7:47 am 
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very strong team!
better than humen.

Quote:
Fold - how about making the priests 0-4 and 5339 with dauntless and stand firm? Might eat into the flagellants a little but that would fit my concept of heavily armoured "shield of the weak" type priests.

i like this idea as well.
Quote:
0-16 Zealots - 6338 - G/ASP - 50,000
0-2 Flagellants - 6337 - Frenzy, Dauntless, Thick Skull - GS/AP - 70,000
0-1 Penitent - 4737 - Ball and Chain, Secret Weapon, No Hands - S/GAP - 100,000
0-2 Witch Hunters - 7338 - Stab, Stakes, Pro - GA/SP - 100,000
0-2 Warrior Priests - 5339 - Stand Firm, Mighty Blow - GS/AP - 100,000

Rerolls: 50K
Apo: Yes
When playing with Sigmar Cults or against them, you cannot hire a wizard

like this we would much clear positionnal:
blitzer / runner / blocker
and what about the "necromancer" of necro/undead team?
are you including it as "wizard" as well ?
it would be logic, isn't ?

maybe, the rule "When playing with Sigmar Cults or against them, you cannot hire a wizard(/necromancer)" is too strong
it should be balanced by:
"When a Priest is on the field, both team could not use a wizard/necromancer"

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