Register    Login    Forum    FAQ

Board index » Blood Bowl » New Concepts




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 37 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:58 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 11:15 am
Posts: 2479
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Hey guys! If youre anything like me then you've been super excited by the new Tzeentch range of miniatures released for silver tower and age of sigmar. When I saw the new kairic cultists, tzaangors and blue horrors my thoughts immediately went to trying to put together an exciting, playable mutation roster together that avoided the usual claw trap and made use of underrepresented skills.

And so, I've been working on this idea for several months with some other very experienced coaches and now think the roster we've landed on really captures the flavour and (unhinged!) fun of tzeentch and has the potential to add a unique set of challenges to the game. I plan to start play testing in a couple of weeks and would be really keen to get input from the community along the way!

Note I've gone for a roster that wants the coach to make big use of its mutation access, but not to bash with; It's deliberate that no player on the team has any bash skills, or strength access (even the big guys); I've looked to use existing and underused skills and build in synergies with other underrepresented mutations; I've sought out interactions between players that make the team play like no other in the game; the roster should be playable as stunties, if desired; and, of course, I've stuck to existing models in the games workshop range.

Well... here goes!

Horrors of Tzeentch Teams

0-16 Kairic Cultists (Lineman) MA6 ST3 AG3 AV8 Thick Skull GM/ASP 60,000GP

0-4 Pink Horrors (Catchers) MA6 ST3 AG3 AV8 Monstrous Mouth, Right Stuff, Throw Team-Mate GPM/AS 80,000GP

0-2 Tzaangors (Blitzer) MA6 ST3 AG3 AV8 Disturbing Presence, Horns, Pass Block GM/ASP 80,000GP

0-2 Chaos Spawn (Big Guy) MA5 ST5 AG2 AV9 Loner, Bone-Head, Foul Appearance, Throw Team-Mate M/GASP 140,000GP

0-14 Blue Horrors (chaos halflings) MA5 ST2 AG3 AV6 Decay, Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty AM/GSP 30,000GP

Apothecary: yes, Rerolls: 50k (Lord of Change)

Special: if a blue horror would land on a player after being thrown by a teammate, or would die by any normal means while on the pitch, the blue horror is immediately killed - mark the square and instead placed in the casualty bin immediately (no apothecary may be used to prevent this death). Then treat the target square as though it had been hit directly by a fireball.

Let me know what you think!

_________________
League and tournament hosting, blogging and individual forums - all totally free. For the most immersive tabletop sports community experience around, check out theendzone.co


Last edited by Shteve0 on Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 9:48 am 
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 2:22 pm
Posts: 275
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Blue Horror journeymen is just rude.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:04 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 11:15 am
Posts: 2479
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Wouldn't be though, the kairic bros would be the journeymen.

Edit: ha, good spot on the journeyman wording. Let's call it 0-14 blues then, since journeymen are "always" 0-12 or 0-16.

_________________
League and tournament hosting, blogging and individual forums - all totally free. For the most immersive tabletop sports community experience around, check out theendzone.co


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:53 am 
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:24 pm
Posts: 410
No 0-2 Chaos Spawn: "Big Guy Player: If the team has any ST 3+ players (other than the Big Guy) then 0-1 allowed"

No Throw-Teammate or Right Stuff on a Basic Player (Pink Horror).

Tzaangors skill look random and not very useful.

Acolytes with thick skull...... in which way is this related with Tzeench....Fluffwise I mean. Looks very random.

I think it is better if you look for a theme and hold on to it. Like this it looks like a fruit salad team.

The idea is fine IMO and a Tzeentch team looks very Cool.


Last edited by Rolex on Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:59 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:20 pm
Posts: 1883
Location: South Wales
This would be my suggestions;

1) I'd drop the cultists completely.
2) Increase the amount of blue horrors to 0-16 and drop there movement to 5 and remove the right stuff skill, maybe drop strength to 2 also.
3) Increase Tzaangors to 0-4 (but otherwise keep exactly the same)
4) Change Spawn completely, drop bone head and replace with really stupid, loose throw team mate, add tentacles and two heads.
5) Then you could introduce 0-2 disk Tzaangors, give them movement 7 with sprint or just movement 8, instead of pass block they could have kick off return and side step (to represent the followers of the Changer of Ways knowing already what's going to happen)

Idea being that the Two Big Guys could move around with the Ag2 and Two Heads so could pin and hold stuff in the middle of the field but they'd need to be baby sat to do it due to Really Stupid. The Pink Horrors could throw fire bombs over the top whilst the Disk Tzaangors could zip around and up the side lines in a side cage of normal Tzaangors. Sounds good eh!? ;)

I realise this completely changed your team but it's just some different ideas.

I love the Special fireball idea for the dead Blue Horrors

_________________
I'm a British Freebooter, will play for any team including Undead (I have my own Apothecary). Good rates.


Last edited by frogboy on Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:10 am, edited 3 times in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:01 am 
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:24 pm
Posts: 410
frogboy wrote:
5) Then you could introduce 0-2 disk Tzaangors, give them movement 7 with sprint or just movement 8, instead of pass block they could have kick off return and side step (to represent the followers of the Changer of Ways knowing already what's going to happen)


This would be 2 players. There is no cavalry in BB.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:06 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:20 pm
Posts: 1883
Location: South Wales
Subject: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster

Rolex wrote:
frogboy wrote:
5) Then you could introduce 0-2 disk Tzaangors, give them movement 7 with sprint or just movement 8, instead of pass block they could have kick off return and side step (to represent the followers of the Changer of Ways knowing already what's going to happen)


This would be 2 players. There is no cavalry in BB.


It's just a game dude, you can have anything you want

_________________
I'm a British Freebooter, will play for any team including Undead (I have my own Apothecary). Good rates.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:20 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:20 pm
Posts: 1883
Location: South Wales
frogboy wrote:
Subject: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster

Rolex wrote:
frogboy wrote:
5) Then you could introduce 0-2 disk Tzaangors, give them movement 7 with sprint or just movement 8, instead of pass block they could have kick off return and side step (to represent the followers of the Changer of Ways knowing already what's going to happen)


This would be 2 players. There is no cavalry in BB.


It's just a game dude, you can have anything you want


WHAT ARE THOSE!!!??

Attachment:
IMG_20161203_171131.jpg


Also I updated the post to include ideas to the team. I realise that some people take this game very seriously, but I don't, it was just feedback for SteveO really not trying to break the game, I'll probably never play anyone on here anyway unless it's a NAF ranked tournament.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
I'm a British Freebooter, will play for any team including Undead (I have my own Apothecary). Good rates.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:53 am 
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:39 am
Posts: 460
Location: Norsca
I would go:

0-16 Blue Horror ....................50k ... 5 2 3 7 Dodge, Jump Up, Right Stuff, Stunty.................................. M/GSAP
0-6 Pink Horror .....................70k ... 6 3 3 7 Big Hand, Splinter, Throw Team Mate................................ GAM/SP
0-2 Flamer.............................80k ... 6 3 3 7 Bombardier, Leap, No Hands, Safe Throw, Very Long Legs.... GAM/SP
0-2 Warriors of Tzeentch..........100K .. 5 4 2 9 Horns.......................................................................... GSM/AP

Re-rolls 50k
Apothecary: yes

_________________
Image


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:56 am 
Rookie
Rookie

Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:51 am
Posts: 1
Horrors could split when cas'd?


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:59 am 
Super Star
Super Star
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 971
I do love the figures and I've been thinking about this idea myself some. But here's some feedback:

1) I don't think there's any justification for this team to have TWO ST5 players. No other form of Chaos (other than Pact) has this, and Tzeentch isn't known for being particularly strong.
2) I think Foul Appearance should be reserved for Nurgle teams, it doesn't really fit with Tzeentch. Disturbing Presence is understandable, though.
3) I like the Blue Horror's special rule, but I'd need to see some playtesting to have an idea of how explosive it is.
4) I don't have a problem with Blue Horror journeymen, personally. I'd suggest 0-4 Cultists or 0-6 Cultists. Make the players field at least a couple of lousy players who like to go boom.
5) I'm okay with Monstrous Mouth getting a second use. But what about having 0-2 Pink Horror Throwers with Big Hand and 0-2 Pink Horror Catchers with Extra Arms instead of 0-4?
6) Frankly, I think the Cultists should be standard human statline 6337 for 60k. Yes, it's a little more expensive than usual, but they aren't the linemen, they get free mutation access, and there's nothing about them that screams AV8 or Thick Skull to me.

If you want to do something really unique with them, convert the big guys into MA6 ST4 AG2 AV8 Loner, Bone-Head, Throw Team-Mate, Sprint, Sure Feet "Disc Riders". This merges some of the functionality of the Big Guy (throwing team-mates) with the utility of a Bull Centaur, and fits the fluff of less-physically strong but mobile Tzeentch players. I might even give them AG3, but that would require some playtesting and peer review.

_________________
Milo


Image


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:16 am 
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:39 am
Posts: 460
Location: Norsca
danj3000 wrote:
Horrors could split when cas'd?


Would go with: When they die.

_________________
Image


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:33 am 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 11:15 am
Posts: 2479
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Hi guys, cheers for the replies! Glad to see there’s similar enthusiasm out there from others for this race :D

Rolex wrote:
No 0-2 Chaos Spawn: "Big Guy Player: If the team has any ST 3+ players (other than the Big Guy) then 0-1 allowed"


Well, I think we can immediately disregard this rule - not just because these are not typical big guys, but also because there are already several teams that break it comprehensively. Khemri, most obviously; Undead; Chaos Pact; even Goblins; now the ‘experimental’ Noble Humans. It’s clear to me that the team dynamics come first, and...

Rolex wrote:
No Throw-Teammate or Right Stuff on a Basic Player (Pink Horror). Tzaangors skill look random and not very useful. Acolytes with thick skull [....] Looks very random. I think it is better if you look for a theme and hold on to it. Like this it looks like a fruit salad team. The idea is fine IMO and a Tzeentch team looks very Cool.


Each player type has a specific role in the team - I’ll step through them in a follow up post (or series of posts) and we can look at how they fit those roles - I know where you’re coming from, and a few went through a number of total re-imaginings before we landed here. Hopefully once we get down in the weeds we can explore these thoughts a bit more and one of us will convince the other on some points :)

frogboy wrote:
I realise this completely changed your team but it's just some different ideas. I love the Special fireball idea for the dead Blue Horrors


Thanks man! And cheers for the thoughts :) Definitely some strong ideas, but perhaps as you say they would take the team a fair distance from the intended playstyle and roles. Will bank for consideration after playtesting though!

Bakunin wrote:
I would go: (roster)


Hah, the use of ‘Splinter’ gives you away - you obviously saw an early exploration of some of these ideas in another thread, that was a skill I came up with for the pinks ;) You won’t be suprised then that I/we looked at a lot of those player types on the way here - in the end the flamers were just too weird, so horrors became the theme. Functionally you can still chuck bombs - it’s just that they can also walk around and pick up the ball (sometimes!) - and as I say, it was an explicit decision not to have any strength type players on the roster for playability and fluff reasons.

Milo wrote:
I do love the figures and I've been thinking about this idea myself some. But here's some feedback: (list)


Thanks man, I’ll bank these - but as above, the players are meant to fulfil specfic roles and steer the coach to develop them in different ways to typical

Milo wrote:
If you want to do something really unique with them, convert the big guys into MA6 ST4 AG2 AV8 Loner, Bone-Head, Throw Team-Mate, Sprint, Sure Feet "Disc Riders". This merges some of the functionality of the Big Guy (throwing team-mates) with the utility of a Bull Centaur, and fits the fluff of less-physically strong but mobile Tzeentch players. I might even give them AG3, but that would require some playtesting and peer review.


No steeds [or capes!!!] in Blood Bowl! ;)

Cheers for input guys - will get to work on the player position discussions over the next week or so (I'm on holiday, starting with a tourney this weekend, but will get to it!) - probably in non-sequential order - to try and give a bit of an idea of why certain ideas are in play here, keen to explore those ideas in context and see if they can be improved. Stay tuned please, this will be a valuable process!

_________________
League and tournament hosting, blogging and individual forums - all totally free. For the most immersive tabletop sports community experience around, check out theendzone.co


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:45 am 
Da Spammer
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2002 10:04 pm
Posts: 23632
Location: Fundamentaling for the BB Illuminati
Mummys and Tomb Guardians aren't Big Guys.
And Goblins don't break it (unless you've rostered them to be ST3).

I'll wait to read your breakdown, but as it stands I'd put this in the pile with Khorne - not broken (maybe) but not an X team. There's nothing really in there that says "Tzeentch" to me, other the the split idea, which has been in pretty much every Tzeentch team ever suggested.

_________________
SWTC 2017 Stunty Cup winner - never again (until next time!)


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playable 'Horrors of Tzeentch' roster
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:20 pm 
Legend
Legend
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 11:15 am
Posts: 2479
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Well, perhaps its dreadful, perhaps its a slow burner. I appreciate its not the most obvious path but I'm personally excited about the possibilities it presents. Let's see!

Darkson wrote:
Mummys and Tomb Guardians aren't Big Guys.
And Goblins don't break it (unless you've rostered them to be ST3).


I refer you to the rulebook, goblins and trolls are not the only player on a goblin roster (did you not consider it unlikely I'd make that mistake?). Also saying Mummies and TGs arent big guys is semantics I'm afraid - to all intents and purposes ST5 players without G access are big guys. I stand by my original point.

_________________
League and tournament hosting, blogging and individual forums - all totally free. For the most immersive tabletop sports community experience around, check out theendzone.co


Top 
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 37 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

Board index » Blood Bowl » New Concepts


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to: