Rat Ogre or no Rat Ogre? Thats the question.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Thu Dec 18, 2008 7:40 pm

Like a Tree with Wood Elves or a Mino with Chaos Dwarfs. For some teams, Big Guys are a great buy at 1M (Orcs, Humans), but that's the exception.

mubo · Post by **mubo** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:57 pm

ROs are massive turnover causers, as I have found to my cost...
On any block you have a 1/9 chance of failure, + 1/9*(the chance of a pushback result), because of frenzy. Against dodgers, this P is higher than you'd think.

Juggernaught helps matters greatly, but then you have to use them for your blitz move, which has a 1/6 chance of being wasted. Plus your blitz actions become very predictable.

I would say they are only worthwhile if you can buy them block fairly cheaply. This years waterbowl for example has a ruleset that allows this.

They do offer something that skaven don't hve, the ability to open cages by force, but with the 6th ed rulebook Fezglitch might be a better (and much cheaper) option...

Vinz D. · Post by **Vinz D.** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 1:07 pm

Although I do agree that Fezglitch might be a better (though definitely cheaper) option to do so, do mind that not all tournaments allow inducements/ starplayers.

Greetz

Xod · Post by **Xod** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:49 am

also remember that Fezglitch is a secret weapon, and how long do you think a secret weapon will be on play with skaven? If you are planning to stall, ok, but I always try to score in 2 turns and then go for the counter.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:06 am

With Skaven though if you manage one turn over you are very likely to draw - and most teams will play to grind you down. So if you receive at the start - score quick. Then you get to field Fezglitch for the rest of the 1st half. If you kick field him from the off.

So he'll probably stay on the pitch long enough!

Glowworm · Post by **Glowworm** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:46 pm

Just played my first game with skaven, trying them out as a tourney team (maybe GT) & after first half was ready to fall back on to my usual undead... however I carried on and they didnt turn out to bad (lost 2-1 to a human team, however I seem to lose every game at present, not a moan just an observation, Im sure things will even out eventually)

The point is I am considering the RO (i didnt use one that match) as after round 1 i can give him "guard" He will add weight to my LoS Linerats and as long as he is "activated" last should (hopefully) get 3 dice against S3 players or at least 2 against other BGs

As an experienced (with other races admittedly) coach i understand the danger of "no Block + frenzy" situation but if they target the RO then other players will hopefully survive longer.

I also like the prehensile tail mutation he comes with (after being mauled by pro elves at spiky) and claws

Comment welcome.... (Not "stick with undead" or even "go stunty")

Vigfus · Post by **Vigfus** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:51 am

Well, given all previous comments, I think it really boils down to the style of play you have with skaven.

At 1M it's definately too expensive, and at 1.1M it can start to be usefull.

As Tuernredvenom says, the Rat ogre is best used in defense. Blitzing players against him to make sure they don't run away.

Personally, I think the best way to use it in defense is not on the line of scrimage, but further down the field where it'll be able to intercept any catchers, either blitzing them or making it difficult for them to dodge (Prehensile tail).

On offense they give you the potential to score 1 Turn touchdowns.

But they can be unreliable.

Vinz D. · Post by **Vinz D.** » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:09 pm

Vigfus wrote:[...]

But they can be unreliable.

*ponders*...

I think that should have been "They are unreliable, but can work excellent."

It's indeed a matter of favour. I used a Rat Ogre at more then enough tournaments (in favour of a larger team) and had matches that went utterly down the drain (partially due to the Rat Ogre, partially due to bad dice rolls for other actions), but also ones that worked like a charm.

Greetz

Glowworm · Post by **Glowworm** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 12:26 pm

Tried out the R/O in a tourney practice match (2Hr duration, 1 extra Skill per team) gave the R/O Guard against Wood Elves.

I was more than happy with his performance, failed W/A twice in the match, luckily both times where non vital (and he kept his TZ which is sweet). On Defence I kept him in the back field for 3 dice against the W/E catchers (even without Block + Frenzy this is not bad odds) On Offence he went on LoS to give the Lino's 2 dice, even tried the Blitzers + R/O on the LoS thats seemed okay (maybe a tactic for use against Norse or Dwarves)

Only problem is to squeeze him in I lose a gutter runner and another Lino so starting team becomes

5 line rats (250)
1 thrower (70)
2 Blitzers (180)
2 G/R (160)
R/O (160)
3 R/R (180)

Im thinking lose 1 R/R to get a Lino for 12 players, after game 1 Guard on R/O after Game 2 give Thrower leader for 3rd R/R then maybe catch or Block on G/R's
Thinking Skaven at Newquay bowl (2 skills or double after each match if same as last year) will rock.

Will try the +1 player + leader this afternoon as see how it works out...

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:29 pm

Most of the Skaven TV100 teams I've seen drop a Storm Vermin and have a Leader thrower to get more Gutter Runners.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:00 pm

Fezglitch seems to me a very appropriate name for anybody football-related. Isn't "fezglitch" a form of wardrobe malfunction?

Glowworm · Post by **Glowworm** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:04 pm

PubBowler wrote:Most of the Skaven TV100 teams I've seen drop a Storm Vermin and have a Leader thrower to get more Gutter Runners.

Hmmm, not sure Id like that idea, Storm vermin come with block which i found is vital on the inevitable 1 dice blocks, altho I think against Dwarves/Norse they would be more useful. 2 G/R seem to be working out, I tried keeping one in reserve on defence, the R/O failed 4 WA rolls this match including a Blitz action after a both down however by that time my opponent had 8 players on pitch (Wood elves) so he could not surround and foul & cage the ball in 1 turn, he chose the latter.

The Guard R/O on the LoS is like a can opener with the Storm Vermin (2dice + block)