The Ogre Spike! and NAF tournaments

[Jip]

Boom, NAF event at GW HQ and they "solve" this debate with one simple paragraph.

That doesn’t solve it; gold and TV aren’t the same thing (e.g. I don’t ‘buy’ the Fan Factor that I gain when I win games, but it counts against my TV) with regards to Disposable. The gold is spent, then the TV drops, which would trigger the inducements.

I really think this is being forensically deconstructed just ‘cos there’s an opportunity to do so, rather than a benefit of doing so.

[nazgob]

Quick question. How many slave giants may I induce?

I don't see a 0-1 limit...

[fromherashes]

Quick question. How many slave giants may I induce?

I don't see a 0-1 limit...

Although it’s not completely clear it does state that they’re treated like inducing Star Players so you could infer from that it would be 0-2.

[Purplegoo]

I would agree with that logic.

They are optional rules, mind. Once we’re over the initial excitement hump, I suspect they won’t be common.

[Bakunin]

Again, can you or not use disposable at a naf tourney?Looks like multiple TOs have declared they are gonna use it.

[Purplegoo]

If you read any of the skill description, the OP or the previous responses I’ve given you, it should be clear. But once again: Disposable does not work at standard resurrection tournaments. I appreciate there are a few people on Facebook that have a different interpretation of the skill description to us / the majority, and they are welcome to give Ogres a different buff in their rulespack to compensate for Disposable not working in the way they hoped it would. It’s not a difficult thing to do.

Consider the above my out of office response (or your signature, either works! ), even NAF staff are allowed a bit of time off sometimes. Have a lovely Christmas!

[spubbbba]

What Purplegoo doesn't want us to know is that there is a secret combination of magic words that will get him to change his mind.

If we keep asking the exact same question with slightly different wording then we'll find it eventually!

[Bakunin]

Jep, it's a radical idea called democracy.

[besters]

Jep, it's a radical idea called democracy.

Then I suggest you stand next time there is an election. I, for one, will be suppoting Phil if he cares to stand.

[Danny]

This thread has made me realise how inducements are used in tournaments doesn't really make much sense, I actually remember the first time I took 'flings at the NAFC and I didn't get how a Chef was going to work, I only knew you could take them as I'd seen other people using them. Someone told me to just put it on my roster as a player, which I didn't get, but seemed to be fine. After that I "got it", but it's probably still confusing for newer players.

I've rewritten the rules section in the StrangleBowl 3 rules pack to try and make this clearer, with an example. Hopefully this will help any newer players and clear up confusing. Any feedback/criticism very welcome! I've attached the relevant page as a PNG, or the whole PDF is at https://stranglebowl.uk/rules

StrangleBowl 3 - p3.png

[Purplegoo]

I think the way inducements are described in most rulespacks makes it clear enough for a newer player how they can be incorporated into tournament rosters, but I agree that there is a general assumed knowledge (not just with inducements) that in some cases makes it opaque for someone new to the scene. I think that’s understandable (in every field, let alone NAF tournament organising), but we could all make more effort with our rulespacks to spell this stuff out, as we were all new once.

Having skimmed your text, is there not an edge case where a Weeping Dagger / Apo interaction means the skill is relevant? I risk thinking out loud there - I’ve not read the skill description in > 3 years.

Lastly, I noticed your work on roster submission on social media. Have you started from scratch with this, or is it a build on one of the existing things? Looks nice, anyway. Having spent years with 90 % of tournament fields submitting rosters on the backs of envelopes, post its and, I think in one case, written on a body part, I totally admit I’m an old curmudgeon in this area, but I know a lot of people like / want it. Probably best not to launch off on a segue about what various posters like in this area; I’m sure there are plenty of threads that can be resurrected for that.

[sann0638]

Having skimmed your text, is there not an edge case where a Weeping Dagger / Apo interaction means the skill is relevant? I risk thinking out loud there - I’ve not read the skill description in > 3 years.

Don't think so - it's Decay where that marginal effect comes into play for Nurgle.

[Purplegoo]

You’re quite right - the first Google hit I got was actually a post I made following the initial conversation / clarification the NAF made at the time.

Rule number one of internet posting - Google first, apply fingers to phone later. Or walk to the other room and open the rulebook, but that’s more effort than can be considered reasonable.

[Danny]

I think the way inducements are described in most rulespacks makes it clear enough for a newer player how they can be incorporated into tournament rosters, but I agree that there is a general assumed knowledge (not just with inducements) that in some cases makes it opaque for someone new to the scene. I think that’s understandable (in every field, let alone NAF tournament organising), but we could all make more effort with our rulespacks to spell this stuff out, as we were all new once.

Having skimmed your text, is there not an edge case where a Weeping Dagger / Apo interaction means the skill is relevant? I risk thinking out loud there - I’ve not read the skill description in > 3 years.

Lastly, I noticed your work on roster submission on social media. Have you started from scratch with this, or is it a build on one of the existing things? Looks nice, anyway. Having spent years with 90 % of tournament fields submitting rosters on the backs of envelopes, post its and, I think in one case, written on a body part, I totally admit I’m an old curmudgeon in this area, but I know a lot of people like / want it. Probably best not to launch off on a segue about what various posters like in this area; I’m sure there are plenty of threads that can be resurrected for that.

Yea I thought it’s easier just to say those skills don’t have an effect as it’s not that clear, even the link you posted for weeping daggers is confusing as it appears to contradict itself - but the verdict is that it has no effect for resurrection tournaments.

The roster tool I scratch build - it’s mainly to help us as it took a long time chasing people for rosters last year and then even after asking over and over for certain formats we got a range from nice pdfs to grainy unreadable photos! So hopefully will save a few days come October! I liked the idea the World Cup had with having all rosters online, it also means rosters can be viewed on a phone if needed if someone forgets to print them or loses them on the day.

Also the options for positionals/stars/inducements is a bit of a mess these days as they are spread over so many books, including CRP, plus a lot of older players don’t seem to want to read the Spikes and then get confused over what positionals/stars some of the “newer” teams can have - at least this should make it fool proof as to what is available and legal.

[Danny]

Quick question. How many slave giants may I induce?

I don't see a 0-1 limit...

I wish GW were more precise. I’ve read it again and it does say just like a star player, but then again it’s not a star player, the wording seems to just be explaining *how* they are induced, and all star players have names - this doesn’t. I’d argue there is a case that this is a form of inducement and not a star?