A Trait to counter Tackle

Ramorr · Post by **Ramorr** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:13 pm

Dwarves...

I hate them, I really hate them. No other reason. I just want one wood elf that can get past them. Just one...

Sorry, I've had a tough couple games. But as a die hard woodie and part time amazon coach, it would be nice if I could occasionally use my favorite skill when playing the beardy half-pints.

So how's about a nice agility trait that cancels tackle and will let me use dodge at least once. It would be a lot better then jump-up.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:17 pm

Tackle was in to counter dodge, would be silly to put something back in to counter it back to the same thing. Your basically asking for tackle to be removed. Elves dodge away into space on 2+ if you really need it you can use a reroll, theses are great odds to get one elf past the dwarfs. If there isn't room for this, you will have to either make a hole with less tz to go through, or simple have to take the harder dodge rolls without the safety of the dodge skill.

Ramorr · Post by **Ramorr** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:32 pm

One, maybe two players who can counter a skill, does not remove that skill. I'm suggesting an anti-tackle trait, not skill.

An entire team with tackle, now that removes a skill. I realise that's the point, but if my teams major strength (and here I'm thinking amazons) is completely removed, its' just not much fun, unless I have some form of counter. One re-roll a turn is not enough if two-thirds of your AV7 team has to dodge out. I don't mind the block dice side of the skill, just the actual dodging part.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:40 pm

Amazons start with dodge, most teams are going to have spend spp getting tackel to counter an advantage you started with. Not everyone on a dwarf team starts with tackle. You should be able to blitz a hole to get through the dwarfs and then pass over them. Dwarfs are immobile use this to your advantage. I do see your point though.

Marcus · Post by **Marcus** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:45 pm

Try Pro, try Leap.

Putting in countering skills back and forth is asinine. You come up against Dwarves, your Dodge is now useless - lift your game and work out how to live without it.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:46 pm

I personally think if someone wants to burn a double roll just to be able to use their dodge re-roll that's fine. What form it would take I haven't a clue.

If there was such a trait i'd be tempted to take on 1 or 2 players, but definetly not on a whole team. there are better uses for a double out there.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:51 pm

Aren't you then going to get dwarf players wanting a trait that they can use to recounter that, do like marcus said, learn to work around it. You have to use different tactics vs different races anyway, this is true of all races.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 12:57 pm

Maybe, but think of the skills a coach could have chosen instead. I'm sure a dwarf would rather play against someone with "ignore tackle" trait rather than Blodge or sidestep or sprint.
My view anyway.

Zy-Nox · Post by **Zy-Nox** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 1:05 pm

Grumbledook wrote:Aren't you then going to get dwarf players wanting a trait that they can use to recounter that, do like marcus said, learn to work around it. You have to use different tactics vs different races anyway, this is true of all races.

I agree here,
But you are Elves,you should have enough team re rolls to allow you your 2+ dodges, Sure Dwarves can be a pain, but I dont really have trouble against them,just adapt your tactics.

vorner23 · Post by **vorner23** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 5:24 pm

The tackle skill is just one of the tradeoffs that dwarves get for being slow ass runners.

Elves should be able to run rings round them.

Post by **Thadrin** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 6:17 pm

Dude, you sound like that muppet from BBMag3 who said Dwarfs were rubbish. You still get 2+ dodges. I've seen Wood elf teams shred their way through Dwarf defences, even without their Dodge skill - for one thing you can guarentee that the one time you fail one of your dodge rolls it'll be when you're dodging away from a Blitzer, Slayer or Runner who doesn't have Tackle. I don't know why but thats the way it happens for me anyway....always. Thats why Tackle was the first skill for one of my Blitzers.

Suck it up and play ball.

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 6:50 pm

Want to counter tackle? Easy, don't give dodge to any of your players. Then you've completely countered tackle.

Currently, dodge is widely considered as more powerful than tackle (it's usually named second after block in power). Making a new trait to counter tackle would not only be ridiculous (hey, let's make a trait to counter the skill that counters the skill, then make babies with our sisters), but it would be counter productive, because dodge is currently more powerful than tackle, and you'd be making dodge even more powerful, and tackle even less so.

I sure hope you were kidding.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 7:25 pm

Zombie can i make babies with your sisters?

Ramorr · Post by **Ramorr** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 7:34 pm

"Suck it up and play ball". Erm... I don't plan to suck anything. You and your crazy american slang.

No I wasn't kidding. I think I don't like tackle because it is the only skill that does counter another skill. I guess block kind of counters block, but most skills allows your player to do something as apposed to countering your opponent. It is frustrating to not be allowed to use a skill on your team roster.

I think if the dwarves can do it to me, I should at least in some small way do it back to them. Not a great argument, mildly petulent, but there it is. Anyway, most people think dodge is so great because it affects the block dice. I'm just after the reroll, so I'd suggest the trait just counters that aspect of tackle. At least that leaves the dwarves more than they would leave me.

Then like the rednecks we aspire to be, we can all go make babies with our siblings.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun Oct 27, 2002 7:41 pm

You have strip ball, sure hands counters that
Pass block at least hinders passing or catching
dauntless counters high strength players

Be thankful you aren't playing teams who also have diving tackle, shadowing, prehensile tail, these all are things to make dodging more differcult.

The tackle dodge situation has been in this incarnation for years, ive not seen anyone else ever see the need to have a counter to tackle.