The dilemma of game progress...

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:27 pm

Just came to my mind:
The historical progress of BloodBowl: First we had 1st ed most of us do not remember, then we had eye candy 2nd ed., it was replaced by the smooth 3rd ed., killed by 4th edition and fortunately revived by glorious LRB which the vast majority of coaches refer to be the best rules-set so far. Nothing is perfect but if 95% works and everyone is happy, there is no reason to change it anymore (with change I mean further progressing the game).
Really no reason? Sure there is: namely to sell extra rules, supplementary magazines and new figs. We know it from the RPG biz, every 5 years a new edition comes up, the same old rules rewritten with new artwork. Many people perceive the game balance getting broken by the scraping of balanced teams in order to introduce new teams (and of course their minis). The undead team-roster vs. Khemri, Vampire, Neco comes to mind.
Is it a dilemma we will never have the perfect game bc the notion of selling new miniatures and rulebooks/annuals will drive the game forward, even beyond the point when everyone had been content with the game???

Munkey · Post by **Munkey** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:32 pm

Apparently GW makes most of their money on the figures though, so we could have new updated figures for the existing teams with no penalty to the rules.

Also I would probably buy an updated set of rules if they released a latest up to date version with all the LRB stuff in and no seperate FAQ to download just to have all the rules in one place.

If they laid out the rules in a more logical fashion as well I definately would buy a copy.

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 9:40 pm

I'm not concerned about having all three years a new mini overhaul for exisiting teams (it would even heaten up my collecting urge) but the danger of "...we need new minis to sell, so make new minis, but those will need new rules and will replace old teams" scares me.

But I agree with you what I would buy...

Munkey · Post by **Munkey** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:02 pm

Exactly, I don't think there is a lot of room for extra teams as the one's we have are already balanced.

GW seem to need new rules each time they make new mini's. Not a good idea IMO.

There have been a lot of posts along these lines and from reading these most people seem a little nervous of the direction GW are trying to go in with the new undead teams, nurgle team, ogre team and now rumours of a new elf team.

Personally I feel a little nervous as I don't think there is a need for a lot of these teams especially as the rules released have a lot of serious balance issues. I realise that they are only experimental but I think a lot more thought could have gone into the development of the original teams in most cases.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:05 pm

JJ talked about this in the NAF seminar, i.e. it's getting to saturation point in what you can do with new rosters to bring different playing styles, so the plan is to concentrate on replacing some of the 'tired' old 3e figs with more dynamic, more BB specific, less WHFB styled figs.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:17 pm

They could always bring out new pitches, like a snow pitch etc ;]

Balrog · Post by **Balrog** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:32 pm

I'd like to see a rulebook with an Index!!!

-Balrog

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:36 pm

Munkey wrote:Apparently GW makes most of their money on the figures though, so we could have new updated figures for the existing teams with no penalty to the rules.

Also I would probably buy an updated set of rules if they released a latest up to date version with all the LRB stuff in and no seperate FAQ to download just to have all the rules in one place.

If they laid out the rules in a more logical fashion as well I definately would buy a copy.

Ah, but if they just made new minis, and left the rules the same, the old minis would still be adequate, and many (most?) people who already have the old ones would not buy the new ones. That just wouldn't do at all!

plus if all the teams are balanced then there's nothing for the little brat 12-yr-old in the store to buy to have the "best" team until the new team is released so he can whine to his parents to buy him that one.

Munkey · Post by **Munkey** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:38 pm

Ha, what do brats know? Just tell him [insert team here] are the best and watch him whine

Post by **Dave** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:45 pm

From what I saw and heard the mini's are going the right way, I like to have SOME new teams cause they fit in the fluff (Vamps, Ogres For Example) but am not waiting for new teams just for the new team bit of it

Balrog · Post by **Balrog** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 10:58 pm

I don't mind new teams as long as they are well conceived and that no old teams get canned to make room for them.

-Balrog

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Thu Mar 13, 2003 11:00 pm

Balrog wrote:I don't mind new teams as long as they are well conceived and that no old teams get canned to make room for them.

-Balrog

well then you can't be remotely happy so far then

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 1:56 am

Deathwing wrote:JJ talked about this in the NAF seminar, i.e. it's getting to saturation point in what you can do with new rosters to bring different playing styles, so the plan is to concentrate on replacing some of the 'tired' old 3e figs with more dynamic, more BB specific, less WHFB styled figs.

They say that but we in reality we have a perfectly good Undead thrown out for 2 crap mini-selling Undead teams, and a new Elf team on the way...cuz we certainly need more Elves! (Speaking of Elves...the new Elf team is to be a more "punchy" Elf team? I thought that was the Human team?)

JJ is full of crap. I know I'm gonna end up going round with Milo again but I really don't think Fanatic gives a damn about "saturation" or "play styles". I think Fanatic is being told to sell minis. If not, why all the new unnecessary teams? Let me pose this question. Why did we need an Ogre team for the minis? We have Ogres already and the new minis would definitely sell for the current big guy rules. I think they "need" a team because that way they can sell 8 at a time.

sean newboy · Post by **sean newboy** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:07 am

I'd like to see a rulebook with an Index!!!

Hello is anyone from fanatic listening???

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 4:40 am

Heck I'd love an index!

If they really wanted to please me they'd have that mess of a rule book rewritten instead of cutting it up anymore than they already have.