New team for open format league

[Hegel]

We run a tabletop league with twelve people and two divisions (people are running multiple teams). Premier division is the real league with eight developed teams (mostly TV160-190) and a fixed schedule, and Open division for fun, team development and no schedule. I´m running a rather unsuccessful orc team in premier (me being one of only two n00bs in premier), and a promising dark elves team in open. As this is all tabletop, every now and then I´m tempted to have a new team, I like diversity and painting as well. Now I haven´t got a clue what to pick and maybe you can give me some advice. I already tried several teams on FUMBBL to get a feeling but here are more criteria. I´d like to learn more about the game, so I don´t want to run a team which is almost the same as orcs or dark elves.

Tried woodies but they´ve been beaten to a bloody mess. Nice models, though, started to convert some from whfb woodies.
Tried necros but always failed to pick up the ball. Awful ball handling... but superb models.
Tried humans, they seem to perform well on low TV and can actually handle the ball (sure hands, pass, catch) without being too vulnerable. Only know the plastic GW models, not completely awful but far away from beautiful.

Any advice would be appreciated. My orcs suck big time against teams with good passing, maybe that would be nice to have as a change ? Or do I overrate passing ? Both divisions have more bash than agility teams.

[mattgslater]

High Elves are a mobility team with a passing option, who are tough enough to sometimes go a little aggro when the situation merits. AV8 on elves is very nice, and High Elf Catchers develop very well.

I'd challenge you to figure out why you're struggling. If the agility teams are eating your lunch in a developed format, it may not actually be a problem with agility teams: Orcs are at their best when they take very little damage, as they need to retain all their Blitzer and Thrower skills to be effective against mobile opponents. The key to retaining Blitzers is retaining BOBs, and the key to retaining BOBs is winning the bash war against bash teams.

Can you post your Orcs?

[Hegel]

My orcs are

3x BOB / block
1x BOB / block, guard

1 Blitzer / dodge
1 Blitzer / mb, tackle, -ma
1 Blitzer / mb, +ma
1 Blitzer / guard, stand firm, mb

1 lino / dirty player
1 lino / block
1 line rookie

1 troll / guard
1 goblin / catch

1 thrower / leader, +ag, block

3 rr

[phil78]

Only know the plastic GW models, not completely awful but far away from beautiful.

There is a metal human team as well, very spiky but an improvement on the one reelased as part of the box set which I assuem you are referring to.
Humans sit quite nicely between the bash of Orcs and the AG4 nonsense of elves so can be a suitable alternative.

[mattgslater]

I quite like the metal Citadel Humans. You could always go for a gimmick team, like the (Neomics?) Bondage team or the Shadowforge Gridiron Girls. I once found a wind-up 50mm tall / 25mm around plastic firebreathing "Nun-Zilla" that I thought would go great with Shadowforge Nuns. (Added bonus: nuns are very easy to paint, and it's super-duper fun to play with shading and highlighting on black and white clothing.)

[Hegel]

Yes they are OK. It´s rather whether or not to play humans. They seem to start strong with lots of useful skills, but how will they do later on ? It is always the same question with teams. Will I be patient enough / my team survive long enough etc to reach a satisfying state ? I mean, high elves start really poor but are a real pain in the back side once skilled up. Necros are awful until they have at least some ball handling skills...

[Hitonagashi]

Humans are always average, at every TV .

You'll get outballed by elves, and outbashed by chaos, but you can outrun the chaos, and out bash the elves. This is pretty much always true!

[mattgslater]

Humans are fine. They peak at about 1600-1800, but they can hang out there pretty much indefinitely, and a peak Human team does fine against other peak teams.

[spubbbba]

Humans are fine. They peak at about 1600-1800, but they can hang out there pretty much indefinitely, and a peak Human team does fine against other peak teams.

Yeah, humans really need stats on their positionals and doubles on the ogre (block) and linemen (guard) to compete above that. Trouble is they also need a bench since they’ll want to foul agile teams and have subs to stay full strength against the inevitable cas suffered against bashers.

Life is tough with a human team since you can’t rely on a single playstyle like the more specialist teams can. But the advantage of them is that more than any other team IMO they will help you improve at the game the quickest.

If you want to do the passing game then high elves are great since they are one of the best teams at it but have better armour than the other 2 options (pro and wood elves). Plus you already know how the linemen and blitzers work from using dark elves and the throwers and catchers are pretty obvious (mind you catchers can make a good safety or blizter).

Undead might be worth a shot as they play pretty similar to Orcs but have a bit more speed and mobility with 4 ghouls and 2 wights. I’d say they were better than Necros at low and high TV but Necros have the edge at mid TV depending on how the teams are skilled.

One thing to note, passing is fun for many but not the most reliable game winning tactic. Don’t spend a lot of skills on it at the detriment of bread and butter skills. I’d not bother with diving catch, NoS, Strong Arm or safe throw. Accurate and Sure hands are both ok choices on throwers though. Catchers want block, dodge (if they don’t have it) and sidestep.

[mattgslater]

You only really ever need two compatible styles. It all comes down to controlling space, dropping your blitz at the key time, minimizing blocks allowed. 4-5 Guards, at least a couple MB with one TPOMB, a couple ballaz, some Wrestle, at least one Dirty Player.

In open perpetual play, you can manage all of this at about 1500-1600. You have no business exceeding this by more than 100k, unless you're bulking up for a tournament. In a league, you're ultimately carrying 100k more in bodies, plus any extraordinary stat luck.