Big Guys for Dwarves

Colin · Post by **Colin** » Sat Sep 07, 2002 12:34 am

DR is fine to bring back as a SW, but I think that it would be nice for dwarves to have their own BG. Skavies have RO, lizzies have krox, etc. So, why not? That's why I suggested an iron golem (but could be brass or bronze golem, whatever).

Norse · Post by **Norse** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 12:18 pm

I think from a fluff point of view it is an excellent idea.. Dwarves would far rather have a machine of their own devising on the pitch rather than an Ogre, and I would gladly trade my Ogre for something more Dwarfy..

I leave stats and being balanced, fair etc to the others, but as a basic idea, I'm all for it...

Relborn · Post by **Relborn** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 12:44 pm

well golems would be too much fantasy to me.

And btw I doubt they would fit into the dwarven Team-Busses /or planes

Norse · Post by **Norse** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 12:48 pm

For those as old as me who remember...

The Snotling Pump Wagon was stolen by Snots from the shed of a mad Dwarven inventor, there must be dozens of weird Dwraven artefacts out there somewhere....

right?..........

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 2:50 pm

Wasn't it supposed to be a lawn mower or something?

Ian

Acerak · Post by **Acerak** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 7:43 pm

I'm going with a Deathroller as the Dwarf "Big Guy" in my next league, which will start in late September or early October. The goal was to create a Big Guy that didn't use exceptions, just basic stats and a negative characteristic to keep it in check:

DEATHROLLER
MA 4, ST 7, AG 1, AV 10
Skills: Mighty Blow, Multiple Block, Break Tackle, Piling On
Traits: Stand Firm
Characteristics: Machine
Skill Access: General, Strength
Cost: 180,000

Machine: For all their sturdiness, machines are rather frail. The slightest
little mechanical problem can sideline one for the afternoon. Roll a D6
before the game and again after every drive the machine is on the field. On a roll of 1, something has gone wrong and the machine must be carted off for the rest of the match. This unsturdiness means that it's never brought out for routine practices, so it may never use Team Re-rolls.

Looks big and bad - and it is, no doubt - but if it becomes a bit much I'll probably yank MBlow and/or MBlock.

Keep you posted.

-Chet

P.S. They won't get Ogres.

Colin · Post by **Colin** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 9:47 pm

I'm not against the idea of using the DR as a BG for dwarves, as long as it is changed from being a SW and not so easy to take out. I still think there should be a little more variety than this, there should be more than one type of machine available, whether it be some sort of robot (iron golem,whatever you wish to call it) or some other steam powered contraption. I like the idea of making a breakdown roll, kind of like a perm niggle, for any kind of machine. I think that no matter how many available only one machine allowed, like most BGs, and they should be more expensive than regular BGs because they wouldn't be really common that every team have one.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Tue Sep 10, 2002 10:27 pm

Chet-
Why not use the current penalty roll for the DR-Big Guy's negative trait?
Just call the trait "Illegal" or "Secret Weapon". That way you aren't inventing rules or making exceptions.

McDeth · Post by **McDeth** » Wed Sep 11, 2002 2:41 pm

Chet-

Can you Deathroller gain SPP's and advances like the normal big guy?

Once its got block it would be unstoppable, oh my god what about dodge on a double, with stand firm as a starting skill, its a monster.

Marcus · Post by **Marcus** » Wed Sep 11, 2002 3:18 pm

I take it a "knocked down" Roller has just lost its head of steam, or is bogged, or similar.

From my experience using rookie death rollers in 3rd ed I have to say that one is extremely nasty. I would suggest changing the move to 2 and giving it the same rules as treemen for getting up.

Marcus

Acerak · Post by **Acerak** » Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:51 pm

Chet-
Why not use the current penalty roll for the DR-Big Guy's negative trait?
Just call the trait "Illegal" or "Secret Weapon". That way you aren't inventing rules or making exceptions.

I didn't go that route because it still creates an exception: one Big Guy is illegal, the other six aren't. My fluff rationale for the lack of a Penalty Roll is quite simple: the refs are too afraid of it to throw it out. They sit back and wait for the thing to rust out on its own.

As for the Deathroller Big Guy I was using:

1. Yes, it gains SPPs normally. And it ages/rusts/wears normally.

2. No, it isn't out of the game on a knockdown. It follows the rules for normal players.

Like I said, if it's a big monstrosity I'll tone it down a bit. Maybe ST6, maybe no MB, maybe no MBlock. We'll see how it plays out. I don't think it will be as good as the 3E Star Player, because (a) it can't ignore TZs to get anywhere and (b) it can't foul at +6 to the AV roll. But it certainly has its advantages.

-Chet

Lucien Swift · Post by **Lucien Swift** » Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:55 pm

i like the idea of a steam golem or iron giant or metal contraption, or whaddever for the dwarfs... assuming they need a big guy at all...

...i mean, why do they get one but amazons and high elves don't?

...so long as not every team gets a big guy, dwarves shouln't get one at all... but once big guys become universal, they should get a brass man!

they'd be fun to convert too...

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:57 pm

There's exceptions all over the place anyway. I don't understand this anti-exception rationale. They already exist and you'll never be rid of them.

What about the +6 for fouling? Isn't that an exception? Or the only big guy with ST 7, isn't that an exception?

And don't even get me going on all the exception out there for frenzy.

Lucien Swift · Post by **Lucien Swift** » Thu Sep 12, 2002 9:03 pm

don't get me started on exceptions!

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Fri Sep 13, 2002 2:30 am

Yeah I don't accept this "no exceptions" B.S. as any kind of answer. There is a ton of exceptions in the game still and you aren't gonna get them out. There's no real reason to get rid of exceptions.
It's just a cop out.