Dwarf defensive alignment?

[Mestari]

I only get 1 die when I blitz the longbeard, and then I hope for a push!
When the dwarf is pushed back, then I don't have to dodge.
But parhaps I am wrong marcus, so could u explain?

Yep, it's practically only a 3+ roll to get the Linedwarf out of the way. Probably with a reroll.

Being a rather experienced pansy-elf-ball-coach, I say that against an experienced coach there's no way you could completely prevent a wood elf or a skaven team from having the possibility of scoring in two turns, unless he completely screws up his die rolls.
They'll probably have several receivers in your half and a few guys to get the ball there near the LOS. And the ball-carrier beyond your reach.

But remember! The Hand-off rule has changed! So you can actually make it a lot harder for them to score, by placing your tackle zones and your single blitz right on your first turn. You can't stop them all, but you can hope to make it a bit more probable that he'll fail something, resulting in a TO and five dwarves surrounding the ball next turn.

From the lineup shown, I'd also move the second line one square backwards. Even though it makes it harder to exploit a sudden fumble in his backfield, it features the quick-snap-safety and your players can reach your own backfield better. I might even move the two central players (runners in this example) back one more square to make it easier for them to reach places.

[Marcus]

OK, anyone who looks for a defensive set that stops anyone getting through is looking the wrong way. There is no such defensive set.

What you should be looking for is something that:

(a) Limits the number of downfield recievers
(b) Requires a large concentration of players on the line to make the breakthough
(c) Isolates recievers to one area to limit the passing lanes
(d) Requires disproportionately difficult dice rolls
(e) Allows you to react quickly to pressure the opponent on your turn.

That one does quite well.

The deep 3 4 4 fails on that count as once you hit the line and blitz the secondary you can fan out all over the pitch or play a deep advance cage. Any set that requires either 1 die blocks to penetrate, or requires the opponent to stack one side heavily and limit their options, is one I generally play for.

But hey, enough of defending my idea. The guy asked for defensive sets and I haven't seen anyone else put one forward apart from voyager's 3 4 4 suggestion

X-pert: I'd still recommend giving that one a try, let me know how it goes in practice.

Marcus

[Mestari]

Quoting myself (:oops:):

"With wood elves, you can always regroup and reorganise your players around the pitch. With dwarves, you pay now for the positioning mistakes that you did three turns ago."

What I'm trying to say is that on defense you have to be extra careful with your free moves and player positioning: with the amount of movement you have at your disposal, you simply can't stress that enough.

You need mobility for a succesful defense unless your opponent doesn't have mobility either, or is dum enough to play to your strengths instead of his...

I have yet to find my favourite defense formation - I've only played three games so far with my dwarves (I played some in mid-90's, but I don't count that anymore).

[Pink Horror]

I don't think that list is the appropriate set of goals for a defense. (d) -forcing bad die rolls, and (e) - allowing you to react quickly are good goals, but the others aren't so good. As I've pointed out, you don't even need "disproportionally difficult" rolls to get through that defense. The line allows an easy breakthrough because getting assists on the front three is easy.

When I coach a slow team, the last thing I want to have happen is to let the offense overload to one side of the field. Any slow player stuck on the other side of the field is out of action for a turn or two. Going through the end of the line against Marcus's defense allows easy access to the outside. Chances are, the dwarfs will need GFIs and dodges to get to the receiver. If you set up deep on the outside, and put a player or two in the middle of your half, you have more room to manuver. Trying to stop the receivers from getting through usually results in failure, so back up and keep them from establishing good positions, like Pariah suggested.

Also, this is dwarfs against starting skaven, right? What are you afraid of that makes you put only three players on the line? If you set up in such a way that entices the stormvermin to the outside, you'll have mostly skill-less players throwing 2-die blocks against longbeards. The chance for forcing a re-roll or causing a turnover is better than the chance for a casualty.



Pink Horror

[Marcus]

Have to agree to disagree on this one.

Suffice to say this setup works well for me against starting elves and skaven as it suits my style of play. I can certainly see how it might not be everyone's cup of tea.