IV. Dungeon Bowl + results

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:28 pm

you got 7 touchdowns in one game?!

man who was that against

Sharky2k · Post by **Sharky2k** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:32 pm

Grumbledook wrote:you got 7 touchdowns in one game?!

man who was that against

hehe

Meradanis · Post by **Meradanis** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 7:49 pm

Mad Mike wrote:I don't understand the order of the players with 13 points in the pure game ranking. Can anybody explain it to me?

The order is pretty weird throughout the whole file. I'm on place #52 (Lustria Prayers), and the team on #51 has fewer TD's, fewer CAS's, equal TD difference and lower CAS difference.
Possible explanation: They've included the sportsmanship value into the pure game ranking. As far as I can remember, it has been stated the second important indicator after the points. I don't think this is a good solution, see for my explanation later in this post.

My personal review of the Dungeon Bowl `07: It's been great fun ! First time I've ever been to a Blood Bowl tournament. Finished on place #10 after day 1, but lost every single game thereafter. I've met many interesting people, every opponent of mine has been polite and a fair sportsman. I'm planning to visit tourney's regularly from now on, joined the NAF on day 2.

Some critical comments:
- Only 1 toilet for approx. 75 male players.

- The organization was good, but the whole "hacking the results into the computer - result printing - double checking - matchup calculation - matchup printing" - process took too long. Didn't get a chance to go out for lunch on Sunday...
- The sportsmanship rating is pretty unnecessary. I don't know if there've been any negative experiences in the past, but from my point of view every participant was a mature player. Actually, I think most people made a pure sympathy rating rather than a sportsmanship rating.
- The impact of the sportsmanship rating on the overall results is far too great. For someone who lost every single game, it is possible to reach a better position in the final table than someone who finished Top 30, solely by being a nice person. It should be used as a tiebreaker for equal points/TD/CAS situations.

Don't get me wrong, the positive aspects outweight my ciritcal comments a dozen times ! I'm definetly back for the Dungeon Bowl 2008, if it's held in DÃ¼sseldorf again.

Edit: One question I have: Is every tournement as bashy as the Dungeon Bowl ? I've counted 11 Dwarf teams and 7 Chaos Dwarf teams. Perhabs you should count the Touchdowns 3 times and the Casualities only 2 times (like the spp's the give) to attract more running/passing teams.

Tim · Post by **Tim** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:03 pm

Mad Mike wrote:I don't understand the order of the players with 13 points in the pure game ranking. Can anybody explain it to me?

Sorry, my bad. I forgot to switch the tiebreakers from the Overall Ranking (Sportsmanship) to the Pure Ranking (Net TD). It's corrected now.

Mad Mike wrote:I had 21 TDs not 20. 14 after 5 games and 7 in the last one. The ranking after round 5 listed my team correctly with 14 TDs.

I changed that in the results file and on the pure game results and i'll enter it correctly into the NAF. Not that it makes any difference ...

Hangus · Post by **Hangus** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:04 pm

Grumbledook wrote:you got 7 touchdowns in one game?!

man who was that against

get bent you bummer.

at least i did not get beaten off a girl or a stunty team

Marc · Post by **Marc** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:12 pm

Thank you for the great weekend!
... and especially thank you to all who lost against my Goblins (i.e. Grumbledook, Frank and Andre(?))

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:18 pm

shush!

Tim · Post by **Tim** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:31 pm

Meradanis wrote:- The organization was good, but the whole "hacking the results into the computer - result printing - double checking - matchup calculation - matchup printing" - process took too long. Didn't get a chance to go out for lunch on Sunday...

If it took long, why couldn't you go out for lunch after you finished your game?

To be honest, handling 80 player tournaments is a bit of work, but i've already offered Sascha some optimization possibilities for 2008.

Meradanis wrote:- The sportsmanship rating is pretty unnecessary. I don't know if there've been any negative experiences in the past, but from my point of view every participant was a mature player. Actually, I think most people made a pure sympathy rating rather than a sportsmanship rating.

I agree somehow and you won't find sportsmanship points in most of the privately organized tournaments. However, it's a general GW thing and my impression is that they don't have an option to leave it out because they somehow have to adopt to GW standards, although Bloodbowlers are a much different kind of gamer than typical Warhammer/40k players.

Where i definitely agree (even as i benefited from it) is that the impact of the sportsmanship points in the overall ranking was too high. The difference between min. and max. sportsmanship points was 13, which equals more than 4 wins (!) and stands in no relation to the impact painting had (1-3 points). But i'm pretty sure we can discuss this with Sascha for the next year.

Meradanis wrote: One question I have: Is every tournement as bashy as the Dungeon Bowl ? I've counted 11 Dwarf teams and 7 Chaos Dwarf teams.

There's several factors playing into here:
- TV 100 makes it difficult to get some teams competitive, most notably Dark/High elf teams. Dwarfss are a very good team at TV 100.
- There are simply more bash teams than AG.
- Germans seem to love Dwarfs, no idea why

However, touchdown difference was already the first tiebreaker, so this was already an advantage to the high scoring teams. If you want a bit more AG teams in the mix, try to attend a TV110 tournament, this might ease things up a bit.

Sharky2k · Post by **Sharky2k** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:54 pm

Hangus wrote:
Grumbledook wrote:you got 7 touchdowns in one game?!

man who was that against
get bent you bummer.

at least i did not get beaten off a girl or a stunty team

hangus, mike avenged me

the game before i got bad luck, and this time you got bad luck

dont be down in the mouth.

Podfrey · Post by **Podfrey** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:19 pm

Thanks to Sasha for (another) great tournie, to ALL of my opponents for 6 of the hardest games I've ever had. Congrats to Barbel on reaching the final and to Daniel for winning it.

See you all back there next year and hopefully we might even spot a German in the bar after 10pm....powergamers

Indigo · Post by **Indigo** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 8:58 am

Hangus wrote:at least i did not get beaten off a girl or a stunty team

Surely you mean a girl AND a stunty team

But you did get humped 7-0

Indigo · Post by **Indigo** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:07 am

I still think the Dungeonbowl is good being TR100 - most tournaments are TR110 so the occaisonal 100 event adds variety and also forces coaches to think about their rosters a bit harder.

Glorian Underhill · Post by **Glorian Underhill** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:48 am

lucifer wrote:
See you all back there next year and hopefully we might even spot a German in the bar after 10pm....powergamers

Well I said you good night an hour later but you were all having problems wearing these mexican sombreros.

And I second the TR 100 stuff. Makes Dwarfs better... in theory.

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:03 am

Tim wrote:Where i definitely agree (even as i benefited from it) is that the impact of the sportsmanship points in the overall ranking was too high.

I totally agree. With sportsmanship I jumped from 47 to place 8, which is not real. I lost 3 games (you're welcome Marc

), so i only deserve place 47.

It's ok to have a special prize "Most Sportsmanship" (and Indigo really deserved it - Baerbel reported me that every KOE and every dice roll worked for her and he still kept his sportsmanship), but it should have less influence on the final result.

Tim · Post by **Tim** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:17 am

lucifer wrote:See you all back there next year and hopefully we might even spot a German in the bar after 10pm....powergamers

Bah, we only left around 23h