Ogres in Dwarf Teams

Redfang · Post by **Redfang** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 1:11 pm

Why can Dwarf teams field ogres?
Sure, a high Str guy is handy, and I'll probably use him, since nowadays (with the rooky Big Guys) you're either stupid or wishing to be dead if you don't get a big guy if possible.

But, Dwarfs never could get an ogre in 3rd edition(well oke, before Deathzone came out they could field Morg) and all through the Warhammer world you keep getting stories of how Dwarfs and Ogres don't like each other... (Ungrim Ironfist and Golgfag)

Why didn't Dwarfs just get two extra slayer or blitzer positions on their roster just like the Dark and High Elves...

sean newboy · Post by **sean newboy** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 1:24 pm

I voted no, they dont need them.

Tamper Magnitude · Post by **Tamper Magnitude** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 1:27 pm

Don't think they should either, but a Big Guy has become almost compulsory in our league, if available of course.

McDeth · Post by **McDeth** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 1:36 pm

No use a Deathroller instead.

Either use same stats as Ogre or hopefully there is something in the Secret weapon rules now to include it

Redfang · Post by **Redfang** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 2:25 pm

That's what I figured to do, use a deathroller with ogre rules. I do have an ogre figure just in case somebody has problems with it though.

If your facing an experienced orc, Chaos or Lizzy team, with 4 or 6 st4 blockers (with Block, at least) and a Big Guy as well, I think Dwarfs DO need a Big Guy, just to keep their cage rolling, the Stronger players will else be able to create too strong a block for a cage to break through.
Access to strength skills alone is not going to pull dwarfs through...

Everybody who can get a Big Guy nowadays, does so, and since almost all teams can, all teams have a Big Guy.
It is more or less compulsory...

Redfang · Post by **Redfang** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 2:30 pm

Sorry, just saw I had a missing option...

Ancalagon · Post by **Ancalagon** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 2:33 pm

I think that the ogre gives this extra punch to dwarf team while LB's dont have guard. I use an ogre on my dwarf team but he usually just stands in front of op. big guy... and to be honest I'll field it if I come to BBowl with my dwarves (not SP but yes BGuy).
Death roller is far expensive and is not worth.

Redfang · Post by **Redfang** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 2:52 pm

The Ogre in my team got Block first and then Guard. He's just a great help in protecting my LoS guard longbeards. Besides, he might not be a great casualty machine (8 cas in 10 games; my team scored 28 cas in total), but that's still 8 players not bothering me anymore and at least one of these cas was a Big Guy.

Trambi · Post by **Trambi** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 4:22 pm

Dwarves seem to want to be monoracial, included in their WHB armies. So sorry, no ogres in dwarf teams

Relborn · Post by **Relborn** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 4:30 pm

Its already known here (I think so) that I do not like the Ogres in the dwarven teams.

I prefer the extra position players to the deathroller solution. The DR is a secret weapon in my eyes and should be covered there (to cover it under Star player or Big Guys seems very lame to me).

Post by **Thadrin** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 4:58 pm

The Death roller as the Dwarf Big guy does NOT work. It's a secret weapon and always should be.

Why can dwarfs have an Ogre? Because Wood Elves can have a treeman, Because Chaos Dwarfs can have a Minotaur, because Chaos teams can have whatever the hell they like, because Orc teams can have a Troll etc etc etc. Remove the Ogre availability from the Dwarf team and you put a knock on a team thats already a tough one to play.

Anyway, Ogres are mercenaries who will fight for any army, not that I claim to be a great WFB expert ( don't even really like it) or play for any team willing to pay the cost as far as I can tell.

If you REALLY want Dwarfs not to get Ogres, then I expect you then to demand ALL teams except Chaos, Orcs and Stunties lose their big guys, and on Chaos teams they occupy Chaos Warrior slots and Orc teams Black Orc slots. That is the ONLY way you could ever keep it fair.

For what its worth, if they finally get around to making The Death Roller and so on available as Secret weapons again then the Ogre will fall even further down my shopping list than it already is...and that's pretty far (I like to have 13 dwarfs including maxed out positions, 5 rerolls and an apothecary first).

Relborn · Post by **Relborn** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 5:13 pm

You do not speak up reasonable Thadrin. Please calm down, and speak again when emotions have chilled down a bit ...

Suggesting Ogres for Dwarven Teams is as silly as having them in the Halfling team.

Just putting them in for balance won't do it. Otherwise we could start putting Treeman into High-Elven Cockerel, or Minotaurs into Dark Elves.

Personally I think dwarves should have the biggest acces to secret weapons (beside the gobbos of course), as they are historically the ones that break da rules most (remember the Dwarf Wahammers, if you could).

Post by **Thadrin** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 5:25 pm

Rubbish. I'm prefectly calm. I think Dark Elves get dicked as well. That's why some people - I belive the MBBL2 being the most prominant - give them Blighted Treemen. If major races - that is, not the stunty ones, with the exception of Chaos - get Big Guys dammit I want to be able to get one. Skaven and Wood Elves have them as fluff, and it plugs a huge hole in their game having them.

I'm not going to settle for "But you do get a big guy. Yes if he gets knocked over he's automaticly destroyed and he gets sent off almost 50% of the time."

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 7:14 pm

Around here, dwarves have been fielding ogres since about 96 or something (i.e. ever since the first big guy rules came out, with 2 per team) and we've never had a problem with it.

Mestari · Post by **Mestari** » Tue Dec 17, 2002 7:24 pm

Ogres suit perfectly to dwarf teams and are the obvious choice for a BG. I can't recall that the dwarves have any great feuds against ogres, and the ogres certainly are mercenaries, so they definitely fit there. Fluffwise and balancewise.

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