Which Halfling team is more capable of winning?

Balrog · Post by **Balrog** » Fri May 09, 2003 3:51 am

To Galak:
Really!? You think that having a Treeman with MA 0 on the field would make the halflings too good? I'm not sure I understand why you think this...

-Balrog

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Fri May 09, 2003 3:56 am

All right, i made up my mind now. Team A is better during the season, but team B is better during the playoffs, when they can pay up to 100k for a single game and make sure the other team doesn't have a single reroll.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Fri May 09, 2003 3:57 am

Balrog wrote:To Galak:
Really!? You think that having a Treeman with MA 0 on the field would make the halflings too good? I'm not sure I understand why you think this...

-Balrog

Its allows them to hold the LOS, still block without follow-up, and still provide scoring opps through TTM.

Now granted I'm playing my first game with the new Take Root, but its turn 6 and neither of my Trees have failed the roll yet. Both have Pro, but haven't had to use it yet. I realize with one game its just luck, so it will be interesting to see my thoughts and other as it gets played out. Lou has a Treeman on his Old World team as well.

Galak

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Fri May 09, 2003 3:59 am

Zombie wrote:All right, i made up my mind now. Team A is better during the season, but team B is better during the playoffs, when they can pay up to 100k for a single game and make sure the other team doesn't have a single reroll.

This of course begs the question of whether the Flings can make the playoffs ...

Galak

Dark Lord (retired) · Post by **Dark Lord (retired)** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:03 am

I think it's funny that 11 people disagree with you and you didn't even list the rules you were supposed to.

Toby · Post by **Toby** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:04 am

Treemen should loose Big guy when Take Root is changed to the "on pitch" version. Again, Treemen suffer from "Big Guy" + "Take Root" + "MA2"

With "on pitch" Take Root, and withot "Big Guy" Treemen would make you waste your team rerolls on them. This would give the Halflings a Leg up, because they have a lot of Team Rerolls, but hit Wood Elfes hard because they lack Team Rerolls. Treemen would be far more effective on Halfling than on Wood Elf teams. As soon as the Wood Elves run out of Team Rerolls, it is like all of ther Players were "Big Guy's". Its the coaches dcision to waste precious Team Rerolls on Treemen or not.

Treemen would use up Team Rerolls for:
-Standing Up
-Taking Root
-Failing Actions

Dark Lord (retired) · Post by **Dark Lord (retired)** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:06 am

Woodies shouldn't even have treemen. It's just stupid.

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:15 am

GalakStarscraper wrote:Okay ... I know certain folks hate the numbers, but a Treeman with Pro on a four drive 4 turn each game will Treeman loses about 6.5 turns a game. Compare this to the 8 turns if they don't show.

And if the other team manages to make the drives last 8 turns, you're in a lot more trouble. But even assuming the best-case scenario that you can keep the game to 4 4-turn drive (and note that this scenario is even better for the halflings than 2 3-turn drives and 2 5-turn drives). That's still 6.5 turns missed per game, compared to 4 on average with the current take root. And the current take root allows you to field someone else instead, while this one doesn't. And you're assuming that the treeman has pro, but in the current version he would have block instead and be much better. The current version of take root, i easily rate as the least negative racial caracteristic. Your proposed version is about three times as bad as wild animal, and more negative than even COFAB. I think i'd rather buy an extra halfling than a treeman with those rules.[/quote]

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:19 am

GalakStarscraper wrote:
Zombie wrote:All right, i made up my mind now. Team A is better during the season, but team B is better during the playoffs, when they can pay up to 100k for a single game and make sure the other team doesn't have a single reroll.
This of course begs the question of whether the Flings can make the playoffs ... :D

Galak

In their first season, they most certainly can. Even version A without ogres is about as powerful as any other team in low TR range (about 100-150).

Balrog · Post by **Balrog** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:57 am

Dark Lord wrote:Woodies shouldn't even have treemen. It's just stupid.

Actually it makes a lot more sense for Wood Elves to have Treemen then Halflings. The Treeman is a Wood Elf Army unit which was brought into BB, Halflings are traditionnally allied with Humans.

-Balrog

Balrog · Post by **Balrog** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:58 am

GalakStarscraper wrote:Now granted I'm playing my first game with the new Take Root, but its turn 6 and neither of my Trees have failed the roll yet. Both have Pro, but haven't had to use it yet.

Testing this rule out with Treemen that already have Pro is pretty much useless, what will it prove?

-Balrog

Dark Lord (retired) · Post by **Dark Lord (retired)** » Fri May 09, 2003 5:04 am

Balrog wrote:
Dark Lord wrote:Woodies shouldn't even have treemen. It's just stupid.
Actually it makes a lot more sense for Wood Elves to have Treemen then Halflings. The Treeman is a Wood Elf Army unit which was brought into BB, Halflings are traditionnally allied with Humans.

-Balrog

Warhammer fluff has no bearing on Blood Bowl fluff. Or does it? I think it does. The only time it hasn't is for the undead BS. Woodies don't need a big guy. Wardancers are their "big guys"

Relborn · Post by **Relborn** » Fri May 09, 2003 7:43 am

[quote="Dark Lord
Warhammer fluff has no bearing on Blood Bowl fluff. Or does it? I think it does. The only time it hasn't is for the undead BS. Woodies don't need a big guy. Wardancers are their "big guys"[/quote]

Well even for Bloodbowl Fluff the Treeman belongs since ages to the Woodelves. That is not the point IMO.

The point is (and this concerns all big guys), that under the current rules it is a no-brainer to include a big guy. IMO it should be the other way round. A normal team should be more effective without an big guy.

Colonel Fatlad · Post by **Colonel Fatlad** » Fri May 09, 2003 8:19 am

Relborn
The point is (and this concerns all big guys), that under the current rules it is a no-brainer to include a big guy. IMO it should be the other way round. A normal team should be more effective without an big guy.

I'm definitely with Relborn on this. A big -guy should be considered a slight liability for most teams to take. The basic teams could then be balanced as they are, and big guys taken for fun/change of tactics reasons only. I really don't want to have to take an Ogre for my human team to be competitive.

Talafar · Post by **Talafar** » Fri May 09, 2003 9:19 pm

I agree with the principle that big guys should not make the team better, but at the moment they all do just that (though you can argue it back and forth on WA)
So perhaps the on-pitch take root could be a little less harsh, especially if halflings land up as the only team with treemen.
How about if you roll the 1 then instead of being removed from the pitch, the Treeman may only take block actions, and may not follow up. Seems simple enough, and prevents TTM after failing the roll. Also note that now if he goes down, he cannot get up again.
Well its an idea...

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Which Halfling team is more capable of winning?

Which team is more capable of winning?